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Women allowed in Freemasonry?

by Bree
(Nashua, NH)

Why aren't women allowed to join Freemasons? I do know that there was a woman accepted a few years ago.

Thanks, Bree

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Feb 05, 2011
Women Freemasons
by: Tim

Bree,

Thank you very much for your question. The topic of women Freemasons is not merely complicated but it quickly becomes controversial, as well. There are, of course, whole organizations and appended bodies within the Masonic family for women, but this doesn't really address the question of why women can't join a Masonic Lodge.

The short answer is, it's tradition and tradition is very important in Freemasonry. That's how our ancient Brethren did it; that's how it's always been done; and, that's how it is. But, that still doesn't really answer the question of why, does it?

I imagine if you gathered together a thousand Freemasons and ask them this question you would get at least a thousand different answers. So far as I know there is no official reason. But, I can tell you why I think it's still a good idea that women do not join the Lodge. To put it as succinctly as I possibly can, when women are around men become idiots.

The Masonic Lodge is meant to be a place of peace and harmony, a sacred retreat of friendship and virtue. Within this refuge men gather on an equal footing and set aside their differences to labor for the good of each other, the community and all of mankind. It's difficult enough to maintain this peace and harmony when the Masonic Lodge is made up only of men. If women were entered into the mix, with all our masculine weaknesses and insecurities, it would be near to impossible.

Maybe that's not the reason at all. Maybe that's just my justification for the segregation. Maybe there is no good reason. But, I do believe that given the wisdom our ancient Brethren evinced in all manner of things, they must have had their reasons.

For more information regarding Masonic bodies available to women please see the Can a Woman Become a Freemason page.

Thank you again for this question. Hopefully, others will share their own thoughts on the matter.

Fraternally,

Tim

Sep 21, 2011
Women being masons
by: Anonymous

I understand the concept that I read above, that the men become .. Not so brotherly I guess how u said it? When women are around and as a women in my 20s at first I was like u know what, fair enough. But then I thought of my Easter Star group and there are masons and women and I have never felt uncomfortable or felt that they feel uncomfortable. I acctuley feel like the combination of equilness between the men and women somehow elevate the whole experience and I appreciate that. That alone has shown me more about the masonic principles than any words could teach. So if it's ok to have them cohabitate for 100 years without incedent then it's kinda officially been proven that it is possible but I respect your opinion. And I respect the rules and will fallow them. Tho I will say I would love to have the opportunity to be a mason one day but I am more than happy in my eastern star group and do not want for anything. But I think it would be pretty awsome as I have an extreme love of tradition and history and like to learn all that I can. But I guess I'll have to wait and see how it all works out.

Oct 06, 2011
Women being Masons - good point
by: Tim

Dear Anon,

I see your point. If men and women can function successfully in the Star, why not in the Lodge?

In the spirit of full disclosure I confess that I am not a member of the Star. Not for any particular reason. My wife has no interest in joining and I have not felt the need to. So, my reasoning on the subject may not be the best, but here it is...

As I understand the way the Star works the Ladies run the show. The men are basically arm-candy and do as they're told. I can see how that would work so long as everyone understands the arrangement going in. There's no competition between the sexes.

But, I'm not so sure that would work so well in the Lodge. During a Lodge meeting men occasionally disagree, sometimes heatedly, but they do not then have to go home together after the meeting. I'm not saying this is a good reason for keeping things separate, but it is something to consider.

I also have to admit I think any good person can benefit from the experience of Masonic ritual and tradition. I think the future holds a place for Co-Masonry as well as women-only Lodges, but whether these will ever be commingled with regular Masonic lodges is another matter altogether.

Thanks for your comments and food for thought.

Oct 30, 2011
Women being Masons
by: Anonymous

I guess no one dares say it. And everyone has to be politically correct so they won't. However, I'm not a Mason, I'm considering it, but haven't petitioned, and have no association with the masons at this point.

I'm going to GENERALIZE here, so don't scold me and say "I don't do that".

A large percentage of Women run their lives based on their emotions and feelings, it's how they're wired, GENERALLY speaking.

Men on the other hand run their lives based on logic and reason.

I'm not saying either is better or worse, and in real life, it's very beneficial in the relationship to have checks and balances in both directions.

However, the Masons are not a husband/wife relationship, it's an organization created by men. These men formed it based on their views. Men's views, without the checks and balances from women.

Therefore it would be pretty much impossible for the Masons to continue as they are, on the path they've always taken, and follow the traditions created by men, if women were able to interject.

It would change. One might argue that it would change for better or for worse, but it would change.

I don't believe personally that the Masons should change, it's among the worlds oldest organizations, and has outlived many countries. That says something for it's structure.

So given that, I think it wise to keep it a fraternity.

I'm sure I'll be chastised here and called a sexist for suggesting there are differences between men and women. But there are. Physical, mental, emotional, quite often even moral.

Allow women if you want it to change, don't allow women if you want it to remain the same, I think it's as simple as that.

Dec 18, 2011
Wisdom unknown to the False Prophets
by: Anonymous

Women have no place in Masonry because they are wiser, and older, and more cunning than the ramrod Church of Reason, an order of thieves and charlatans at the top, and subservient automata at the bottom.

Show me the stone that the builders rejected: That is the cornerstone.

The Pharisees and the scribes have taken the keys of knowledge and have hidden them. They have not entered, nor have they allowed those who want to enter to do so.

There is nothing hidden that will not be revealed, and there is nothing covered that will remain undisclosed.

WHEN YOU MAKE THE TWO INTO ONE, AND WHEN YOU MAKE THE INNER LIKE THE OUTER AND THE OUTER LIKE THE INNER, AND THE UPPER LIKE THE LOWER, AND WHEN YOU MAKE MALE AND FEMALE INTO A SINGLE ONE, SO THAT THE MALE WILL NOT BE MALE NOR THE FEMALE BE FEMALE, THEN YOU WILL ENTER THE KINGDOM.

Having kept secret the reality of the Adam Kadmon, under sanction of silence, and sent humanity into a vice of darkness, the Masons would do well to remember that Whoever blasphemes against the father will be forgiven, and whoever blasphemes against the son will be forgiven, but whoever blasphemes against the holy spirit will not be forgiven, either on earth or in heaven. There is light within a person of light, and it lights up the whole world. If it does not shine, it is dark.

Your days are numbered, control is slipping away, and the silence guarding your secrets of darkness will not fathom The Light.

Jan 10, 2012
re:
by: Anonymous

"days are numbered" ....must be speaking of radical feminism!

Jan 15, 2012
women in masonry
by: Ana

I find the anonymous comment from Oct 30 to be most offensive. There is no genetic evidence that women base their decisions on emotions and men on logic.

I, personally, believe women should be admitted. I have been reading extensively about masons and find them to be dedicated to rationality of mind, among other things.

The rule against women was created in a time when women were thought to be less than men. Nowdays, women are considered politically, socially, scientifically equal to men. I can find no logical basis to continue to exclude them.

Furthermore, the old requirements required a man to be "sound of body." It was explained to me that that this is no longer strictly followed because it was a rule created when the masons were actual stonemasons and physically impaired men would not be able to join this trade. It seems incongruent, then, that other outdated rules with no continuing rational basis are still followed.

I have also read that "Each person must learn and practice self-control. Each person must make sure his spiritual nature triumphs over his animal nature." If this were true of a mason, it would seem to me that the presence of women should not disrupt his intellectual discourse. I believe men, especially masons, to be capable of putting aside their animal attraction to women and relating to them intellectually as equals. Masons can put aside other differences they have with other humans in the name of peace and harmony, so why is gender such an indefeatable challenge?

And, if a possibility sexual attraction is the mason's bane, are gay men unallowed to join? Or are they capable of putting aside their attraction to each other long enough to think of something higher?

Thank you for your time,
~Ana

Jan 22, 2012
Seriously
by: Anonymous

The very principle that makes the Freemasons who they are is basically what makes them in my opinion currupt as religion. For it is the notion of free thinking that is the foundation and it's principles. To not allow a gender into the fraternity goes against that principle thought! It's biased, and bias is not stength, but pure ignorance, that in turn breeds more ignorance. Our common element is we are all human !

Feb 20, 2012
mcp
by: Anonymous

This is directed at the "man"who posted on Jan. 10. Since when is feminism radical ? It is simply half the population of humans on this earth demanding to be treated with the same consideration given to the other half of the human population.

Apr 04, 2012
Equality
by: Natasha

How come Freemasons stand for equality with race, nationality or even sexuality when it comes to men, but not with gender? It's incomprehensible in my eyes. Everyone should have the same rights. Do men not have to go through an interview stage before they are accepted? Why can't women be put through that as well to observe that any particular woman won't unbalance the harmony. Surely masons are meant to be strong minded and won't be uncomfortable or distracted with something as little as women being accepted also. I'm sorry if some people perceive this as being whiny but it just doesn't fit in my head. I know it's all about tradition and it's impressive that it has been kept that way for so long but women are equal to men in pretty much all other aspects of life, so why not this?

Apr 16, 2012
not whiny
by: Anonymous

You voicing your opinion is not whiny. People who want to silence you or who disagree with you label your opinion as whiny. Once again, my husband has gone to the lodge and once again I feel sick to my stomach. I tell him this but he refuses to quit. I don't know if I can continue to live with him supporting gender discrimination.

May 09, 2012
Women and Freemasonry
by: Scott

I am Sr. Warden of my lodge, and I can tell you that there is no actual reasoning behind it today. However, what I will say is that there are some things better left as they are. There is nothing in freemasonry that women would not be able to understand or do. It is mainly a matter of tradition. Just like the catholic church does not allow women to become priests, not because they wouldn't be able to do it, but that's how it's always been done. Masons try to stay as close to the original teachings of the fraternity and do not like change. Let's keep in mind though, that there are thousands of men only fraternities, and women only sorities, this is just another example. We do care for women very much in masonry, in fact we probably wouldn't be able to survive without our wives and families in masonry. This is why we have made the other bodies such as the Eastern Star, Job's daughters, rainbow girls, amaranth, etc. But regular Masonry will not allow women for the same reasons we don't change anything else in masonry, because it's tradition. You may think it to be terrible of an organization to not welcome change, but it is what it is. Plus, men need a place to go where we can get away from women for a while lol. I say that not out of disrespect but just because it's true. For the person that asked about gay people, they are welcome in most lodges but they are better to keep quiet about it. Masonry is very conservative and old fashioned but it's a don't ask don't tell process. A man is still a man no matter what his sexual orientation is, but we ask everyone to keep their sexuality to themselves if they think it could cause trouble. Thanks for reading hope this helps a little bit!

May 10, 2012
Wisdom of our ancient Masonic Brethren
by: Tim

Actually, there is sound reasoning behind the ancient tradition of maintaining the Masonic Lodge as a men only sanctuary. And now, science has demonstrated that our ancient Brethren knew what they were doing. A new article from Scientific American about a recent study explains it much better than I can:

"Why Interacting with a Woman Can Leave Men "Cognitively Impaired""

To quote from the conclusion of the article:

"Overall, it seems clear that whenever we face situations where we’re particularly concerned about the impression that we’re making, we may literally have difficulty thinking clearly. In the case of men, thinking about interacting with a woman is enough to make their brains go a bit fuzzy."

So, it's not an anitquated tradition after all. It's science.

May 11, 2012
Women are the weaker then man.
by: MIKE D

I used to be a proponent of equality amongst the sexes in all matters of life largely because I have 5 sisters and was raised by a single mother in America. Only after traveling around the world several times did women teach me the larger truth. The fact is that women are weaker than men overall. This is physically visible when we look at the physical strength of a woman, but this also extends to the mental strength of the two genders. Look at the disproportionate gap in men to women that hold leadership positions. In America this kind of rhetoric is unacceptable, and these are not my feeling but the beliefs of women that I have encountered.

May 11, 2012
Hi Mike
by: Anonymous

You must have encountered women with a far different outlook than mine.

I'll have to look into that article but the initial article you quoted Tim, could be interpreted in many ways. Just because a psychologist carries out an experiment, does not mean the results apply to any situation. Results of experiments must be able to be duplicated by others and I have not seen that the experiment has been duplicated.

So, what if a person who was a woman and had a sex change wanted to become a mason ? Could he ? What about a transgender woman who still has a penis ? I think fraternities or sororities are outdated and unnecessary as well.

My husband should have known that the whole thing would be unacceptable to me. I just try to make it as difficult as possible for him to attend. Hopefully he'll get it one of these days.

May 13, 2012
Scott
by: Anonymous

The OES is not masonry. That point was emphasized during my initiation. I want the same symbolism and learning as my husband experiences. Masons are like little boys with their forts. No girls allowed. One would think that by adulthood, they could leave these childish notions behind. Particularly so as they love to congratulate themselves on how wise and morally superior to others they have become since becoming masons. Over the past year in which my husband has become a mason, I have learned that basically, it is an organization of pathetic, old fools. They love women as long as the women behave in ways that are acceptable to them. I choose to conduct my life in ways that I find are acceptable to myself. We need to stop questioning why there are no women in masonry. They have no answer that makes a lick of sense. (By the way Tim, the research you have cited lacks a sample group of variable ages as the average age of the sample group is 21 years.)

May 13, 2012
You make my point...
by: Tim

The fact that you think age would make a difference demonstrates my point: men and women are different. The age of the man does not matter. The only difference is that at 19 years of age we want all women to like us, and at ninety years experience has taught us that not all will. Regardless though, at any age when dealing with a woman our lizard brain is always whispering from the deep recesses of our mind, "She's pretty; I want her to like me." It's just nature.

Can men and women thrive in a mutual setting? Sure, but in different ways than in separate settings. We have our setting and we like it that way. You want to be a Mason, co-Masonry and women only Masonry is available to you. Go for it.

But then, maybe you don't want to be a Mason. I can't tell because you are an enigma. On one hand you state that you, "..want the same symbolism and learning as my husband experiences," but in the same paragraph you state that Masonry, "...is an organization of pathetic, old fools." So, why do you want the symbolism and learning of pathetic old fools?

May 14, 2012
Tim
by: Anonymous

I do not wish to be a mason any more. The way in which the whole thing operates makes me sick. Seriously ? "She's pretty and I want her to like me." ? I could understand that a 21 year old with raging hormones could think that way but not someone who perhaps requires viagra.

May 23, 2012
Advice please...
by: Anonymous

My new boyfriend decided to tell me after living with me for 9 months that's he's a Freemason, he stopped going to lodge for a year but now wants to return. His parents have bullied me to allow him to go, so I asked questions that he would not answer, I have researched it & it makes me feel sick. Why didn't he tell me in the beginning, instead he made sure he was very much part of my life & went everywhere with me, he didn't want me to do anything on my own, he still doesn't. I suggested I would go out with my friends when he goes to lodge but this upset him. Double standards! I let him go on one night & asked about it when he returned, he told me of rituals where people are buried, stabbed in the heart or cut throat, that to me sounds sick. I have decided that if he wants to go then he must leave me, it disagrees with all of my beliefs. If I could go too I would more than likely support it, given the chance. I feel this has put a huge wedge between us & his parents don't like me now. So is this in the spirit of masonry? I am a kind hearted, honest & loyal person who does a lot for charity & people in general but im not good enough for him. He says he won't go but it's something he's done for 10 years so will always be with him & in the back of my mind. Has anyone any advice?

May 23, 2012
eye roll
by: Anonymous

Ditch him ! You don't want anything to do with this mason b.s., believe me. You can do better.

May 23, 2012
Advice please
by: Anonymous

Thank you, I thought he was my Mr Perfect though & I'm sad that this has changed everything. I would like to forget about it. I constantly think of ditching him but need to be sure I won't regret it, he has said he will leave masonry as I'm more important to him. Now I know that it's not just a lads night out, that it's a religion & a faith it seems to have more of an effect on me. I'm so paranoid. Is it likely I'll get over it & is it likely he will? I'm actually obsessed by it now & it's eating away at me. I wish it would go away. I've tried to remember what was so perfect about him & it was because he was normal, so I thought, now I think he's far from normal. Do I throw away a chance of happily ever after, just in case?? Sorry for being so dramatic, this isn't like me at all :(

May 23, 2012
Women are the best!!!
by: Blue eyes

I would suggest the reason they don't allow women in now is that whenever women get involved in something they make it better & can make the men seem useless. Men are SCARED of women. Women can work full time, be a mother, clean the house, have food on the table, pay the bills, look amazing & still find time for more. The mason men would be no more the minute the better sex got in there!!!!

May 23, 2012
Cut him loose...
by: John

I agree; cut him loose. He needs your permission to do something he loves, enjoys and finds fulfilment in? By all means, ditch him. His parents want their son to be happy? What's up with that? Kick him to the curb.

Your research into Freemasonry made you feel sick? Then you haven't a clue what it's about. He wasn't keeping a secret from you until he became engrained in your life. Masonry becomes a part of those who take it seriously. It's a fraternity that we belong to. It's not a faith or religion. Your research should have told you that. It is a system of moral teachings which uses symbolism and allegory as its teaching tools. It teaches and encourages a man to live life honorably and in service to his fellowman.

The rituals are morality plays which teach, among other things, the importance of keeping one's promises; to continually study and educate oneself in order to be a useful and contributing member of society, and that deeds done while here in the body can have lasting consequences or provide lasting blessings for others long after we're gone.

Your boyfriend hasn't changed. He's still the guy you thought was "Mr. Perfect." You've simply learned something about him that you didn't know before, (although, he does sound a little controlling if he doesn't want you going anywhere without him.) I would imagine there are things about you that he does not yet know.

It sounds to me like you were looking for an exit strategy and you've decided that his being a Mason is it. So, take a bow, cut him loose, and let him find someone who actually knows what loyalty means.

May 23, 2012
advice
by: Anonymous

I believe your Mr.Perfect is very controlling. Sounds like his parents are the same way. If they are poking their noses into your lives now, it will only become worse if you marry this guy. Let me guess. He didn't once tell his parents to mind their own business did he ?

Freemasonry has become the bane of my existence. They will never admit it is a religion. It doesn't make guys better men. If I ever thought my husband would join up, knowing what I know about it now, I would have thought long and hard about marrying him.

Don't believe what the last guy said. It's not a matter of loyalty. It's a matter of you being with someone who does the right thing. It is my experience that a man involved in freemasonry is not that type of person. I wish it would just go away as well and we could just live our normal life again. Don't have regrets. If he's out of the way, there will be room for someone better for you.

May 24, 2012
Response to John & Anonymous
by: Anonymous

John, Thank you for taking the time to respond, did I hit a nerve? I find your comment, "let him find someone who knows what loyalty means" quite offensive. It surprises me that as a man and a freemason you are going to a better world, eternal life but your wife and daughters or female kin or friends are not worthy of such a thing. What I am beginning to find is that men involved in this are more in love with this than their families, although arent families supposed to be one of the most important things? My boyfriend stopped going for a year and didnt want to return, his father kept on and on and eventually when that wasnt working they involved me, thats how I learnt about it, both of his parents bullied me into talking him into it. I would never have known about it if they hadnt become involved & he was clearly happy that way, perhaps he realises that its not the be all and end all. I feel sorry for you and others like you who clearly have nothing more satisfying in life than this. Believe it or not morals and honour arent just something taught by freemasons. Are you saying your parents and schooling didnt teach you these things? When my partner left, his marriage had broken down, none of his so called brothers even attempted to make any contact to check he was ok, when he returned for one meeting, approximately 5 out of 70 asked how he was, nothing deep just surface questions, why would that be? Because they dont really care and by acting the rituals and saying the same things over and over again makes them think that they are good, but in fact when they leave that room they are the same as everyone else, if not worse because of the opinion and arrogance they have of themselves. I know if a close friend or sister of mine was unhappy and needed me I'd be there in person like a shot. Its a sad shame that you feel the need to brainwash people into believing they need to be a FM to be a good person. He has seen that in me and understands that he doesnt need to be a FM to fulfil that. Lets just see how his parents react because that will make all the difference. He said he did it for his dad, when I asked if he would include his son in time, he said never, again why would that be? Some things i will never know and in honesty would prefer not to.

To the person who left the last comment, thank you. Its a shame that men cannot see whats right in front of their noses. Thank you from the bottom of my heart for your honesty.

May 24, 2012
Neither Angels nor Demons...
by: John

Hello Anon,

My remark regarding loyalty was in response to your claim that you are a loyal person when you seemed to be abandoning a relationship of nine months because you learned something new about your boyfriend, and didn't wish to understand it. That doesn't sound like loyalty to me.

In your original post you said that he wanted to return to Lodge. Now, you say that he does not want to, but his parents are bullying you both. If he doesn't want to go to Lodge, then he shouldn't go. Becoming a Mason is a choice, just as attending meetings is a choice, as is remaining a member. It won't do him or anyone else any good if he doesn't want to be there.

You also stated that your research of Freemasonry made you feel sick and that it disagrees with all your beliefs. But then, in the very next sentence you say that you would support it if you could go too. Forgive me for being confused.

Freemasonry has nothing to do with gaining eternal life. It is not a religion. It offers no path to salvation. It has no Religious doctrine. I don't know how else to say it. It's not a religion. It's a fraternity.

Freemasonry is never supposed to interfere with the family. And yes, the family is more important. Some men do take it to the extreme, just as some men watch too much sports or spend more time at work than they should. If a man is spending too much time at the Lodge and not enough at home, then it's the man's fault and not the Lodge's.

No one needs to be a Freemason. It's a choice, and we do not claim to have some sort of monopoly on honor and morality. It's a fraternity with fundamental tenets of morality and honor.

I'm sorry about your partner. I can't speak to that as I don't know the circumstances, but I can say that being a member of a Masonic Lodge does not necessarily mean that you become personally intimate with every other member. You form a few close personal relationships, many friendly acquaintances, and with the rest you are simply members of the same club. The promises we make are to help, aid and assist, and I feel certain that had he asked for help or let it be known that he needed assistance he would have received it. As you say, you would come to the aid of a close friend or sister. Any close friend would; this has nothing to do with being or not being a Mason.

In summation, if he doesn't want to be a Mason then he shouldn't be one. He should be honest with his parents and move on. And, everyone needs to stop blaming the organization for the very human faults of its members. We're just men and women doing the best we can, like everyone else. We're neither angels nor demons.

Best regards,

May 25, 2012
bigotry
by: Anonymous

John. By being involved in an organization that does not accept as members people of either gender, my husband is supporting gender discrimination. That is the fault of the organization. Period.

May 27, 2012
Where's the beef?
by: John

No, it's your opinion that the organization is discriminatory, but there are hundreds of thousands of Masonic wives and widows who would disagree with you. The fact remains, however, that yours is a matter to be settled between you and your husband. It's not the organization's fault that you don't like the way it's set up.

I love the way you say, "Period" as if you've made a point.

Best,

May 28, 2012
discrimination
by: Anonymous

People of either gender are not welcome to join the masons. That is discrimination.

Jun 12, 2012
Calling wives or girlfriends of Freemasons
by: Anonymous

Hi all. Are you the wife or girlfriend of a Freemason? If so I'd be really interested in knowing your views on it. Good or bad. How it makes you feel? As a new girl to all of this I have my own views but am interested in yours. Thank you.

Jun 13, 2012
calling all wives or girlfriends
by: Anonymous

As you can tell from my previous posts, I am not at all happy that my husband continues to participate in the masons because membership is limited to males only. Has your husband/significant other already joined ? Did anyone from the lodge come and talk to you abut any of the rules or expectations ? They didn't in my case and now it's too late. I beg him to quit every time he attends lodge.

Jun 13, 2012
Wives & GFs
by: Anonymous

He has been a mason for 10 years and was married during that time, somebody did go & meet his ex wife before he joined to talk about it, but his marriage has since broken down. Nobody has met with me but in honesty I wouldn't want anybody to as it wouldn't change my views. I have expressed my views to him quite a while ago & he said he doesn't want to go anymore, I've left that choice to him & haven't made any threats so would like to think that its a decision he's made alone. However I don't know what he's told his parents about his reasons for not going, but he doesn't seem to want us to mix anymore, he speaks to them & visits them when I'm at work and socially we've done nothing with them since his decision. I'm guessing he's used me as his excuse for not going and I also guess they are not happy about it. I constantly think that maybe I should persuade him to go, but would be doing that for the wrong reasons, to ease the situation with his parents, so instead I decided to not talk about it anymore & just see what happens & what he does. Apparently he asked his dad what book I could read to help me feel better about it but a book won't change the way I feel, no book has materialised anyway so it seems the whole thing has been swept under the carpet. It's still on my mind constantly though & the fact he's done it for 10 years & is a master mason will never go away. Is it just the fact that they don't allow women that angers you?

Jun 16, 2012
wives/girlfriends
by: Anonymous

Yes. The gender discrimination bothers me the most. If you are a devout Christian, you may be bothered by the idea that masons use the Bible but never mention Jesus. Anyway, if your partner is not attending lodge any longer, just be happy about it. His parents are not your problem. Yes, they will blame you for him quitting. So what ? Obviously the lodge was unimportant to him if the book did not materialize.

Jul 13, 2012
Hemp lady
by: Anonymous

Hemp lady is everywhere.

Dec 07, 2012
My boyfriend is a mason.
by: Anonymous

i couldnt be happier, at first i was a bit sceptical as he didnt really want to tell me anything, and my internet findings scared me... But hes opened up a tiny bit and now i realise that it means alot to him, its a family, something to look forward to and somewhere to relax without being nagged at... He did say i was welcome to visit the lodge, but i declined, i think he needs his own space and his own friends, its healthy to have other interests :) i have only been with him for two weeks but already i can see chivalry, a lovely sense that he cares for me and every mason we see in the street has welcomed me with open arms, i dont think its a cult, or anything bad, its purely a group where men can have their "man secrets", be accepted and maybe face their fears about public speaking haha!

Dec 08, 2012
Helped my fear of public speaking
by: Tim

Dear Anon,

I'm very pleased to hear that you kept an open mind toward Freemasonry until you could determine the truth for yourself. And, you are absolutely correct in regards to our fear of public speaking as an example of the good Masonry can do for each of us. When I became a Mason I was literally petrified of speaking in public. To this day I have one 'F' on my college transcript and it's for a public speaking class. Since becoming a Mason I have gone on to become a teacher and a lecturer. I regularly speak before small groups and large crowds, and actually enjoy it. Among other things, Masonry presents opportunities to step out of our comfort zone in an atmosphere of support and encouragement and attempt things that we might never have the courage to attempt otherwise.

Thank you for your comment on Masonsmart and please give my regards to your boyfriend.

Fraternally,

Tim

Dec 10, 2012
Advice Please
by: Anonymous

It is interesting that you have this conception that one gets stabbed, beaten etc in Masonry. This an absolute falsehood. If you have a boyfriend who is a Mason and has not corrected what you have somehow learned, then he is in error. Masonry is a men's fraternity where men work in harmony at all levels of life. Once you cross the threshold of a Masonic Lodge everyone is on a level field no matter what occupation you hold in the real world. The world society still needs men and women organizations where men talk about men stuff and women talk about women stuff. Masonry is a charity organization. Have you heard of the Shrine Hospitals, Scottish Rite Speech clinics etc? The foundation Masonic Blue Lodge is where all these other branches must start. Brotherly love is a hallmark of Masonry.

Dec 11, 2012
Cods wallop
by: Anonymous

What a load of cods wallop! Men & women can talk about men's & womens things anywhere haha. Brain washing is all it is & they got you matey!

Dec 29, 2012
men stuff ? women stuff ?
by: Hemp Woman

I am curious to know what anon considers "men stuff" and "women stuff". If "men's stuff" is sports, then I'd be interested too. If that is the case, why is that so secret anyway ? If by "women stuff" you mean menstruation and/or childbirth, those are not really big topics of discussion amongst my female friends. Even if they were, men are involved in those things so I'd discuss those topics with men if they wanted. Please anon, educate me.

May 27, 2013
Evolve
by: Kraus

I came across this page because I was curious as to whether or not the fraternity would allow women due to the fact that a local one had moved to a smaller location because they "could not afford the previous". Every day I walk across the street and admire the Scottish Rite building which is now vacant and curiosity led me to research.

Then, I read these comments. I am a woman. I have an intense personality. It is exhausting consciously finding a balance within myself while also trying not to overwhelm others "being myself". To the person who said that females are the weaker gender. You are mistaken. We are trained from birth to do what we do best. Take care of the home, take care of others,... promote growth. Men will never understand that. It is their insecurity that breeds this segregation. As I age, I appreciate more the difference within each sex. And while brain chemistry and genetics show that females are more advanced, I appreciate males. I am not a "feminist"; I am simply aware.

I also understand that modern freemasonry (and possibly past) is not something that I would like to be involved with. The fraternity crumbles. And while there will always be a few to pass on the traditions, it will only be a matter of time until it is extinct like all other ideas that refuse to adapt.

I will continue to admire the architecture of the abandoned Scottish Rite building but now have a new perspective. I have met a few current members of freemasonry and understand why the fraternity is crumbling.

And, for the men that say women distract them and what not. Of course we do. A beautiful woman who can think for herself is extremely intimidating. There is a reason for that. They call that power. Power that a man does not have... because there have been few men in my life that have had that effect on me. That doesn't make us weak, it makes you weak. I choose to control my power and that takes strength.

Jun 02, 2013
The future of Freemasonry...
by: Tim

Dear Kraus,

Thank you for visiting Masonsmart and for taking the time to share your observations and conclusions regarding Freemasonry. The errors of which are entirely reasonable and completely understandable. They are, in fact, simple human nature.

The Masonic fraternity is a reflection of the society in which it lives and works. Wherever freedom is treasured and appreciated, whether it be newly won or in peril of being lost, Freemasonry thrives. The Masonic fraternity exists throughout the world and while it may be struggling in some parts it is also taking root, blooming, blossoming and growing in others. Thus it is in nature; change is a constant state of being.

To view the entire Masonic fraternity through the prism of a single locale is an extremely narrow point of view. Indeed, in some parts of the world the local Lodges and Grand Lodges are struggling, but in others we are seeing an enthusiasm and rejuvenation of Masonry like most of us have only heard about in the old, 'how it used to be' stories of Masonic history.

Furthermore, to judge an entire organization consisting of millions of members worldwide based on having met a few local members is like assessing the state of the worlds oceans after having peered into a tide pool. It's a matter of perspective and while your observations may be accurate your data is far too shallow to support the depth and breadth of your conclusions.

It's also important to note the distinction between Freemasonry and the Masonic fraternity. Freemasonry is a philosophy; the Masonic fraternity is an organization made up of men, women and children. The fraternity does indeed have it's ups and downs, and could eventually crumble and become extinct. Similar such benevolent societies have in the past. But a sound philosophy, such as Freemasonry is, can not crumble and will never become extinct. While its popularity may wax and wane it will always find a place in the hearts of men and women who seek knowledge and understanding.

The questions that the philosophy of Freemasonry endeavors to assist us in answering are universal and innate. So long as man stands gazing to the heavens in wonder; so long as we seek to know ourselves and our brother; so long as we strive toward humanity, Freemasonry is in no danger of extinction.

Fraternally yours,

Tim

Oct 30, 2013
Tradition is used as an excuse, often...right up until it no longer is.
by: JenniWest

Having been born at a certain time in modern history, I definitely have one foot on each side. I have been told many times over the years, when I have inquired about particular careers, that because I don't have a penis, I am not allowed or would be wise to look elsewhere. When I was 17, I applied to Navy flight school and was told I need a penis to fly planes. I applied to be an astronaut in NASA, and was told that only people with penises can fly to space. I was told when I tried to go to school to be an architect, that I would not have an easy time because I would have to spend all my time at construction sites and that required a penis. They even went so far as to tell me that I would be overlooked in apprenticeships in favor of men, unless they were desperate.

That was in the 1970s. Now, in 2013, we all are much wiser. We know that people without penises make excellent pilots, astronauts and architects. Engineers. Construction workers. Etc. And guess what? People WITH penises make excellent nurses and nannies. So even on a practical level, that kind of discrimiation has given way to LOGIC and REASON.

All except the Freemasons and other "fraternal" organizations. Because men tend to think more LOGICALLY and REASONABLY, as per the previous comments, I'd like to hear the logical and reasonable reason why people without penises can't join the Masons.

Men and women work and live side by side in every area of life. So please spare us that silly "men don't behave around women" thing. That made me laugh out loud.

Oct 31, 2013
The logical and reasonable reason...
by: Tim

Wow, that is impressive. I don't see how you could have possibly crammed one more use of the word "penis" into that post. I hope you're not implying that the only difference between the two sexes is the existence or absence of the aforementioned appendage because that would be, well....sexist...wouldn't it?

The fact that the idea of men not behaving around women made you laugh out loud only demonstrates that you have as little understanding of the basic nature of men as we do of women. The earlier post was not intended to infer that men could not behave in a civilized manner in mixed company. You're right; we all do it every day and in every aspect of life. But the lodge is a refuge, a retreat, a place where men can be themselves absent of all the other roles of their lives. As you so rightly state, men and women work and live side by side in every area of life. That being so, is the occasional and harmless refuge truly so much to ask?

Of course we can behave ourselves in mixed company. Sometimes being in mixed company is the absolute best. But in mixed company we have other roles to play, roles that we cherish and love and that make our lives complete. And yet, while these may be our most important roles they do come possessed of a certain weight to carry. In the lodge we do not need to be the husband, father, son, provider, protector, defender or any other of the myriad roles we all play every day. For a few hours, once in a while we get to be a different version of ourselves, a version that taps into the basic nature of being a man and communing with other men.

Is this an experience that can be appreciated and enjoyed only by men? Certainly not. Can this experience be replicated in mixed company? I don't think so. But, is that a "logical and reasonable reason" to exclude women from Blue Lodge Masonry? As has been discussed earlier and elsewhere the teachings of Freemasonry are readily available. There are no copyright protections on its symbols. In short, Masons do not own Masonry. If you want to study Masonry, if you want to form a Masonic society, there's nothing stopping you from doing so. But then, this isn't about wanting to be a Mason is it? This is about not wanting to be excluded. I get that. We all want to be able to become whatever it is whether we really want to become that at all. Being disallowed, for any reason, flies in the face of our sense of justice and fairness. But then, nobody ever promised us life would be fair.

So, what is the "logical and reasonable reason" for excluding women from Blue Lodge Freemasonry? Frankly, and speaking only for myself as no one speaks for Freemasonry, I don't believe there is one. Fortunately though, and again speaking only for myself, we don't need one.

Respectfully yours,

Tim

Nov 24, 2013
Twoddle
by: Anonymous

What a load of twoddle, it's not even worth the questions/comments/opinions as the responses are clearly so very biased. If these men have a need to relax (which I think means pretend to stab each other, bury each other alive etc making them true gentlemen) without the company of women, who are we to stop them....

Nov 29, 2013
Exactly....
by: John

Exactly right. Thank you for understanding.

Dec 05, 2013
Get over it!
by: Traveler

My sister was a member of a sorority in College nobody complained that men couldn't join. I'm glad she had that experience! My wife loves the fact that I'm a mason. But then again she's not the insecure type. Masonry doesn't need to be defended, and control freaks often mask their insecurities with feminism this is obvious when they rant about how we should let them in and then turn right around in the same paragraph and denounce us as a bad organization. My advice, find a women's only club and quit complaining.

May 01, 2014
Well said!
by: Tom

Traveler, you've hit it right on the head.

Freemasonry doesn't need admiration, support or - especially - permission from those who criticize us for 'encouraging gender inequality' or some such twaddle. That they object, mock and criticize brings a major 'meh'. It's a fraternity, a group for men. Deal with it. What the ignorant and biased think is immaterial to us and the more inflamed they get - beyond pitying them for their closed, anger-dominated minds - the less we will care. Deal with that, too.

Frankly, while I greatly admire women as a group, I would not wish to sit together with some of the bitterness and finger-pointing seen above.

Jun 17, 2014
Support for FM
by: Steph

My Grandpa is a FM, he has been for 50+ years, I am not a "believer" in anything and I can't say that I understand FM even after reading all info on this site, but if there is a place my Pa can go to find some peace and harmony that supports his beliefs then it mustn't be too bad, obviously us females don't know what goes on behind closed doors, to be honest I don't really care.

He is proud to be a member, he is happy when he goes to Lodge and he is happy when he comes home from Lodge it's as simple as that. He loves it.

He gets to see friends that he has known since he joined, have some male bonding time and get out of the house (he and my grandma are both retired and home ALL the time so the best part of his week is to get out and go to Lodge)and he enjoys it. My Grandma could do the same if she wished with an organisation that she finds fitting but she chooses not to.

As long as he is happy going I support FM...I just don't understand it.

Reply from Tim:

Thank you Steph. Very well said and very much appreciated. If you haven't already expressed these feelings to your Pa I'd be willing to bet he would appreciate knowing how you feel. If he knows you're interested in understanding Freemasonry he might even try explaining what it means to him. Be prepared though, Freemasonry touches the heart and many of us have difficulty explaining it, even to ourselves. Like you, we know it's important but we don't always understand why.

Thanks again,

Tim


Jul 04, 2014
They see women as a curse
by: Zana Elohim Life Form

Freemasonry refer to women as being:
anathema  
1. women to be detested or loathed: That a woman is an anathema to the cult.
2.women to be accursed or consigned to damnation or destruction.
3.a formal ecclesiastical curse involving automatic excommunication.
4.A imprecation of divine punishment.
5.A curse; execration.”

Freemasons : An Earth based middle semi-public hierarchy of the religio political elite.This all male theistic cult that segregates other genders, like the above groups of the hierarchy, Is the driving force of resulting the extinction of all life on the planet they reside on, they infiltrated governments, political private organisations such as the CIA,almost all banks that handle the earth currency system and they farm earth citizens as human capital in the primitive Earth society .

Even if they do accept women and men ….. The hermaphrodites (intersexed) like myself would be turned away , and be seen as an abomination.

This evil cult needs evolve or end, and equality brought to the planet.

Jul 05, 2014
Poor Zana
by: Tom

Zana,

Wow.

Just wow.

So many errors, so many misconceptions, so much ignorance that it's hard to know where to start. So much fear, so much hatred that it's problematic whether or not it's worth even trying, but let's try.

1. Women are *not* 'anathema' to Masons. How very silly. They are not admitted into our meetings, true, but that's light-years away from anathema. But let's see a source for your claim, please.

2. Women are not *cursed* to eternal damnation by Freemasonry. What nightmarish site have you been reading? That's more than just silly, the thought itself is nauseating.

3. A formal curse and excommunication? We don't do curses and excommunication is not one of ours. We're not a religion; how could we possibly excommunicate somebody? We are here to try to improve out members; curses are unheard of. Where did you see this - a reference, please?

4 and 5 don't even make sense.

Zana, somebody has been feeding you hate-filled lies. Instead of seeking out bile, rumour and gossip, step back and do some objective research. Think for yourself.




Jul 05, 2014
Zana Elohim Life Form
by: Anonymous

Fremasons call women anathema :;
: loading data recall on public data :

the concept of women becoming Masons is, for all intents and purposes, an anathema.

http://www.masonicinfo.com/women.htm
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freemasonry_and_women
http://www.masonforum.com/viewthread/1930/#14396
http://books.google.co.uk/books?id=qYxCAQAAQBAJ&pg=PT125&lpg=PT125&dq=anathema+women+freemason&source=bl&ots=9tzyUI-2s4&sig=4B0U-EVtZAV0GOKcHjNe52HKOII&hl=en&sa=X&ei=2n64U_7xOaeS7AaMiIHoBw&ved=0CC0Q6AEwATgK#v=onepage&q=anathema%20women%20freemason&f=false
data overflows, text truncated….
"you should get the idea" as response for human understanding

Information not lies
Freemasons are killing the planet, freemasons hate women, gender inequality causing humanity unbalance to humanity self destruction within 21 years.
Fraternity is fascism and human segregation together with financial apartheid and gender discrimination.
Noted rejection and coverup
Freemasonary is dangerous cult/religion…
reason -> belief in supreme being.

Freemasonary needs to be terminated to save the planet.

Jul 05, 2014
Zana's conclusion
by: Anonymous

Freemasons have made planet Earth into a nightmare of death, pollution and money slavery and do not register their crimes against humanity.

Complete extermination of freemasonry is eminent for the survival of life on planet Earth… , else life faces extinction within the next 21 years.

Jul 05, 2014
Strike Three
by: Anonymous

Oh, Zana. Dear me.

So I look at the links you provide. The Masonic info site says, "... the concept of women becoming Masons is, for all intents and purposes, an anathema." It does not - as you claim - say that Masons view *women* as anathema. That's a major difference - Strike One.

Nothing in the Wikipedia article you cite says anything lke what you claim, either. Strike Two.

Nor does the forum, your third reference.

And that's Strike Three. All you have done is make a bunch of very silly accusations, ones for which you have shown no proof whatever.

Literacy is our friend, Zana.




Jul 05, 2014
you deny any evidence
by: Anonymous

The problem you caused this planet with sexism is not a baseball game, you dismiss any oposing truth ... to cover your damages to peoples lives and get away with murder... you sexist testosterone scum....

Jul 05, 2014
Yawn
by: Anonymous

And *that*, boys and girls, is what the Anti-Masonc claque calls rational, enlightened discourse, their messianic contribution to the enlightenment of the world.

Thanks for coming out.

Jul 05, 2014
response to your guilty dismissal
by: Anonymous

A planet without men.

Dont I wish I lived on a planet where men dont exist,
Equality hardly exists in this planet of males and females
Hermaphrodites and Androgynes are asumed to be a myth
Yet so many earthlings believe that a god is not a myth
Transsexuals and transgenders are frowned on,
Conservatives consider the small and big changes an abomination.
In some places even women are put down not alone by segregation.

Men dominate the planet, together with their invention,
The oldest mind manipulation called religion
The religio political leaders that made this planet a prison
Are all males, who abuse little children.
From the the highest levels that no one can name their positions
Down the authoritarian pyramid of political theism to the free masons
All male totalarian testosterone penis brain driven bunch of scum,
Raping mother earth until she bleeds into the stars, cutting her open.

Will mankind, yes, man kind, kill mother earth, with nukes ?
Sprawling her insides into the moon in full glare of the sun ?

If only this planet had no men, men as such, this man kind
The inhumane insane human, burning babies on giant owl statues
Molesting boys in churches, marrying little girls in mosques...
Making millions of money from civil and world wars they caused.

I wish I lived on a planet that had no men, especially this man kind.
If there were no men, such as these , we would be exploring galaxies by now.

Jul 14, 2014
Great Poetry !
by: Hemp Woman

Is that your poem Zana ? If so, you are a talented writer. Given the content, this sounds crazy, but I find it strangely beautiful. I don't agree with everything you have said but I have come to understand the "money slavery" that goes on in this world. I do not believe that every man in freemasonry is a good man trying to be better. I do believe that everyone who cooperates with the "money slavery", more is better striving, myself included, shares the blame for the survival of that system.

Jul 27, 2014
Outdated
by: Anonymous

From all the comments I concluded that Freemansory is no longer what it used to be, it is an outdated institution that can only continue to exist but downgraded to be just a fraternity, a community of men to support each other to better themselves.
No longer it is the exclusive place to discuss, practice and learn about the power of the mind and achieve a higher level of spirituality, since that knowledge and espiritual principles are no longer kept secret and are available to all to practice, including women, outside of freemansonry. I think women would get really bored if they joined the masons. It is no longer what it was...

Jul 27, 2014
Spoken from Ignorance
by: Tom

"From all the comments I concluded that Freemansory is no longer wha it used to be; it is an outdated institution... No longer it is the exclusive place to discuss, practice and learn about the power of the mind and achieve a higher level of spirituality..."

Which comments would those be? Looking at them, they can be broken down into about five types:

First, those actually asking questions. Good for them; they are trying to learn, but they do not know about Freemasonry. That's why they are asking.

Second, non-members offended by the men-only nature of Freemasonry. Whether their opinions are right or wrong, they have little idea what goes on inside.

Third, women claiming to be in a relationship of one sort or another with a Mason - some pro, some con. Ditto.

Fourth, the seriously misandrous, willing to believe anything, no matter how irrational or unsubstantiated, so long as it reinforces their twisted view of the world.

Lastly, Masons, the only ones who actually know the true nature of the Craft.

Which group of comments leads you to believe that it's outdated, no longer a place to develop?

Jul 27, 2014
reply
by: Zana Elohim Life Form

Thanks, Hemp Woman, well I have found poetry has more of an impact than wordy rant, since it colours the words and reflects meanings with emotion, almost like telepathy. Well I personally do not make the money system first priority in life, because life is more important, and money is a delusion , just as much as theism is.

Then my reply to Tom's "non-members offended by the men-only nature of Freemasonry. Whether their opinions are right or wrong, they have little idea what goes on inside."

You are terribly mistaken, especially those that are naturally not born to conform the gender binary, since we have experienced life living as both genders at one time before we realised its nothing but segregation and fascism, where the truth is you are a sentient being regardless what exists in between your legs.

Jul 27, 2014
Topic
by: Anonymoustom

Sentience is indeed in the brain, not the genitalia. XX or XY make no difference.

Aaaand,,, so what?

The issue which was being discussed in the post you are commenting on was whether or not - based on all the previous comments on this thread - Freemasonry is still relevant today, something more than a mere social club. My comments had nothing whatever to do with sexual orientation, relative intelligence, etc, so it's curious you felt compelled to drag that in.

My point, which I cannot think how to make any clearer in English, was that most of the commenters did not - could not - have the knowledge to make their comments relevant or valid.

As a man, I would not presume to tell as woman about the experience of childbirth as it is something I cannot possibly have experienced. Similarly, non-Masons (of whatever sex or orientation) have not the experience to pontificate on whether or not a man can benefit from Masonry.

Perhaps we could try to stay on-topic...

Jul 27, 2014
zana
by: Anonymous

your the one thats deviating the comment, and masonry is gender fascist, thats my conclusion, like it or not, its the truth, and because they are involved in banks and private corporations and government, they have screwed people more than helped, as well they have prevented progress, such as the example of Nikola Tesla and GP Morgan.

Jul 27, 2014
Loony rants don't impress anyone
by: AnonymousTom

Honestly, Zana, do you practise in the mirror so you can say this stuff with a straight face? That you dislike men as a group is clear enough; it's a free country, so that's your right. And you are ticked off that we're a fraternity as opposed to an all-sex group like the Girl Scouts. Well, that's your privilege, too.

But when you start dredging into third-rate tin-foil hat websites to find 'evidence' of how wicked and powerful Freemasonry is, you're just making yourself look silly. You shown not a shred of proof for such foolishness (gentle hint, links to general Wikipedia pages don't count as proof).

Oh, second hint, if you are going to try to present loony-tune claims as anti-Masonic fact, at least try to get the the craziness right. The TFH claim about Tesla involves a financier named JP Morgan, not GP Morgan.

You can prove me wrong with a rational discussion. Obscene rants lose points.

Jul 27, 2014
so now I am loony ?wtf
by: Zana Elohim Life Form

Now you why I preferred to express myself in poetry, soon as I am talking about it normally I get called loony , stupid, etc… The same old lame technique to dismiss the obvious and burry it especially by members of the male gender, hoping it would never stick out again. But hell you can't call the story of Tesla and Morgan as being bogus, it is so obvious and precise like how shit sticks to a carpet. The more you tell someone they are stupid from what they learned from observing the corners of society that hey have been tossed in by rejection, the more crap you going to get from people in the future, because people nowadays prefer transparency and openness and truth.

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