Can a Muslim be a Freemason?

Hi. I'm 18 years of age and I want to be a Freemason, but I'm a Muslim and I heard rumors that a Muslim can't be a Freemason. I would be grateful if you would tell me whether these rumors are true or false.
Thanks

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May 11, 2011
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starstarstarstarstar 		Salam Alaikum!
by: Anonymous

Salam Alaikum Brother,
I myself am a Freemason and a Muslim. As long as you believe in God and you are a man of good moral stature, you are an eligible petitioner to Freemasonry.
I hope this helps answer you question.

Bro. Carey
Wisc. Blue Ldg# 248
Jun 05, 2011
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starstarstarstarstar 		Read and learn
by: Anonymous

No other thing deserves more trust than these two. Almighty Allah says: "O ye who believe, obey Allah and the Messenger when He calleth you to that which quickeneth you, and know that Allah cometh in between the man and his own heart, and that He it is unto Whom ye will be gathered." (Al-Anfal: 24)

Freemasonry is a secret organization whose beliefs and practices are totally kept confidential except from those who are initiated into it. They have levels of secrets which are not divulged to those who are at lower levels. A Muslim should never fall prey or give allegiance to something which cannot be scrutinized by the firm criteria of the Qur’an and the Sunnah. Whoever joins Freemasonry is like a person who writes a blank check; by doing so he agrees to give allegiance blindly to an authority to comply with their wishes no matter what they are.

No Muslim can surrender his will unconditionally to anyone but Allah. If anyone has done so, he is guilty of the most blatant violation namely shirk (associating partners with Allah). Allah says: “Do they have partners beside Allah who shall prescribe for them rituals that Allah has not sanctioned.” (Ash-Shura: 21)"
Jun 06, 2011
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starstarstar 		Knowledge and Ignorance
by: John

I commend your apparently extensive knowledge and understanding the Qur'an, but please recognize that knowledge of the Muslim religion does not grant insight into a fraternal organization that you know nothing about.
A Freemason does not give blind allegiance to any man or institution. In fact, it is the exact opposite. Freemasonry teaches that a man is to think for himself, find and follow his own destiny, and reject tyranny in all forms.
Freemasonry is not a religion, nor does its teachings conflict with any religion. It teaches universal brotherhood among all men of all religious faiths. It is upon this platform of universal brotherhood that Freemasonry unites men of every country, sect and opinion.
Aug 08, 2011
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starstarstarstarstar 		ask seek knock
by: Raymond Conder

why do so many people get mightily upset when you ask the question: Are you a [email protected]
Sep 25, 2011
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starstarstarstarstar 		how do i join?
by: femi

how do i join masonic brotherhood..., cuz i have read little about the group and it fascinating though am a Muslim
Oct 06, 2011
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starstarstarstar 		Being a Muslim Mason
by: Tim

Whether you can become a Freemason depends more on the government of the country in which you live than your chosen religion. Good men of all faiths are welcome to petition for membership in the fraternity, but the governing powers in some countries do not allow Freemasonry to exist as an organization.

Freemasonry teaches freedom, equality and truth. If these teachings are not a constitutional part of the government in your country then organized Freemasonry may not exist there. However, this does not mean that the teachings are any less valid or important.

You do not need to be a member of the fraternity to practice Freemasonry. Find other like-minded men; study some of the many books written about Freemasonry by Freemasons; discuss your findings and your beliefs and look within yourself for truth.

If you do live in a country where Freemasonry is active
visit our Joining Freemasons page for an explanation of the process of joining.

Best of luck and thank you for your question.
Oct 06, 2011
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starstarstarstarstar 		IMPORTANT
by: muslim girl

hey,why do you want to be a free mason i am muslim i will give you the reason why you shouldnt but it is your choice why do you want to be from them?what will the masonic worship will give you that islam doesn't give you,,,remmber if you went to the masonic worship and then returned to islam you wont be comsidered as a muslim i know the honest pure person is inside you defeat the devil i know the chance to be a muslim is a small chance but pls read some quaran you will regret i a sure you pls dont
Dec 30, 2011
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starstarstarstarstar 		ARE U DUMB
by: Anonymous

are you dumb ! youre worshiping the devil, whoever says they are muslim as well as a free mason is commtiting shirk ! use youre brains they hate muslims
Jan 10, 2012
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starstarstarstarstar 		I can't believe what I'm hearing
by: Anonymous

Salams my young brother! I'm a Muslim as well as a freemason. Yasser Afatt was also a Muslim and a freemason. My Allah be pleased with him.
Jan 12, 2012
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starstarstarstarstar 		is it possible to quit
by: Anonymous

If I was accepted to be mason, could I change my mind or quit later without any punishment from Mason.
Jan 12, 2012
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starstarstar 		Yes, you can quit the Masons
by: Tim

Yes, it is possible to demit from membership in the Masonic fraternity whenever you wish. However, when you become a Freemason you make certain promises and take certain obligations, and as an honorable man you would be expected to keep your promises.

Would there be punishment for not keeping your promises? Not from the Masons. Many men have broken their promises and violated their obligations without consequence from the fraternity. The punishment would come with the knowledge that you are not worthy of the trust and confidence placed in you when making those promises.

Thanks for your question. Fraternally,

Tim
Jan 13, 2012
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starstarstarstar 		Yes you can
by: Mike357

You can become a mason and I invite you to do so. I had the priviledge of fellowshipping with a brother of the Muslim faith and we had some very enlightening conversations. After some serious thought and study, we came away with the realization that the two actually are very similiar and both contained answers that were asked by the other.
Jan 14, 2012
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starstarstarstarstar 		I am a muslim and when I was interested alhamduallah I did not become one
by: Anonymous

The mason's have the belief that they came from solomans temple... No one will deny that.. All you need to do is read Surat al baqara verse 102 and start researching from there. Please make the right decision stay in the path of the all mighty God.
Jan 15, 2012
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starstarstarstarstar 		Thank you muslim
by: muslim girl

Thank you soooooo much for trying to convience him/her I tried but I didn't get an answer and yea read also soret yassin(soret yassin will make you ashamed of how have you even thought to be a free mason)
Jan 16, 2012
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starstarstarstarstar 		Lost Property of the Believer
by: AsadSayfu-Llah

Allow me to share with you, wisdom of the Messenger of Allah. The Holy Prophet (s) said that knowledge is the lost property of Believer. Wherever he may find it, it is his, because no one deserves it more than he.

"Wherever you find knowledge, take it, even if it is in the hands of the ploytheist."- Ali ibn abi talib (ra)

The reason that Muslims are misguided to disrespect Freemasonry, is because their minds are saturated with Christian propaganda. They don't realise that the anti-Mason Christians hate Islam even more than they hate Freemasonry. In fact, they blame Islam for establishing Freemasonry via Templars via Ismaelites- The same Christians say our Beloved Prophet Muhammad is Baphomet. Astaghfirullah!

Rewind 500 years. The Cathloic Church slaughtered Muslims, tore down the Moorish Empire, and called Muslims as heathens. They considered you to be a satan worshiper if you said the world is round.

The same cathloic church also accused the Templars of worshiping Baphomet. They executed the Templars based on the same kind of lies they told about the Muslims.

Allah says in Quran, surah 49, that we must investigate when news is brought to us from an evil man. The christians who lie against Muslims cannot be trusted, so Muslims need to stop believing everything that the anti-Muslim Christians say.

Allah says investigate, so Muslims are OBLIGATED to investigate. Those who obey Allah's command, investigate by joining the Fraternity to learn the Truth vs slander.

Those who disobey Allah and follow their aniti-mason, anti-muslim, Christian enemies- assist the Christians in spreading slander without proof. This is ignorance and a shameful practice.

Muslims who are Freemasons should organise to combat this foolishness. We have knowledge because we seek knowlegde with justice, not prejudice.

Muslims who disobey Allah in this matter should be admonished.

Allah is Nuru samaawati wal ard- LIGHT of the heveans and earth.



Jan 16, 2012
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starstarstarstarstar 		About Solomon's Temple
by: AsadSayfu-Llah

The Quran ayah which mentions Solomon clears his name of any wrongdoing. If you take the time to read the ayah, you'll see it is talking about Black magic, not Freemasonry. You cannot condemn anyone if they study about Solomon. And think about how you contradict yourselves:

1. A masjid was built under Umar's command, on the ruins of Solomon's Temple. It's called Temple Mount and Muslims consider it Holy. That's why its called Quds. So you contradict yourselves by blaming Freemasons in connection with Solomon's Temple when you yourselves consider it a Holy place. Three fingers pointing back at you. ...

2. The Templars were students of Muslims who controlled Temple Mount. That's where they got their knowledge, not from satans. The Muslims did not teach Black magic to the Templars. So please go back and read the ayah with presence of mind, and do not jump to conclusions just because satan put a suggestion in your head via anti-Muslim/Mason Christian propaganda. You cannot give da'wah by wearing ignorance on your shoulder



Jan 17, 2012
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starstarstarstarstar 		what does mean anti-mason
by: Anonymous

I do not believe that there is anti-mason.
Jan 30, 2012
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starstarstarstarstar 		please listen brothers
by: Anonymous

I am a Muslim and have seen the disadvantages of close mindness.Allah is perfect, TheHoly Prophet(SAW) is the last prophet. please research more about the noble Free-Masons. Try finding the book The Secrets of the Free-masons by Pat morgan.
Jan 30, 2012
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starstarstarstarstar 		I am back with evidence
by: muslim girl

1st:
Is Freemasonry a religion?
No, Freemasonry is not a religion. Masons who treat it as such are mistaken. Freemasonry strongly encourages its members to belong to an established religion, although that is not a requirement for membership (only that a candidate profess a belief in a Supreme Being). Masonry is a fraternal organization that encourages morality and charity and studies philosophy. It has no clergy, no sacraments, and does not promise salvation to its members.

2nd
But what about terms like "Temple," "Worshipful," and so on?
Labor unions meet in a Labor Temple. A museum may be called the Temple of Fine Arts. This does not mean that they are religious institutions. The same is true of Freemasonry. (Masonic buildings are also called Lodge Halls and Masonic Centers as well as Masonic Temples. Some Scottish Rite buildings are called "Cathedrals," but that is from a Greek word meaning "chair," and referring to the seat of authority of any sort.)

The term "worshipful" stems from 18th century English usage, when Freemasonry in its present form was being organized. The term has nothing to do with religious worship but is an old synonym for "honorable" or "respected." Check any good dictionary!

Similarly, Freemasons engage in group prayer and have a chaplain, just as do the armed services and the houses of Congress. That does not make Masonry into a religion

3rd:
Is there a conflict between Freemasonry and established religion?
There is nothing in Freemasonry that conflicts with most religions. However, Freemasonry does insist on religious tolerance. To the extent that certain religious groups would wish to suppress other religions or persecute their followers, Freemasons would be in opposition to such activities, and adherents of such groups would be both uncomfortable and unwelcome in Masonry. It is also the case that certain religious groups are misinformed about Freemasonry and believe things about the Fraternity that are not true; basing their opinions on this false information, they then formulate opinions that create conflict.

4th:
Why do certain fundamentalist groups oppose Freemasonry?
Mostly out of ignorance and misinformation, although possibly out of fear of competition for time and attention with the church (churches have been suffering the same loss of active membership over the past few decades as has Freemasonry). Ignorance of Masonry allows misinformation to spread. For example, it is claimed that Freemasonry has a "plan of salvation" that is in opposition to that of the Christian Church. Simply not true; nothing in any of the Masonic degrees refers to salvatio

you can also visit a site that i will asure you not to be a freemason because why leave your religon to go to no relgion!!
here is it:
http://web.mit.edu/dryfoo/Masonry/Questions/difficult.html
Mar 14, 2012
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starstarstarstarstar 		i want more knowlege and truth
by: mjsearch4truth

My question is? the levels of knowledge between masons who are politicians, musicians, and atheletes! Are their levels of freemasonry that are evil? Does it differ from the masons who are fraturnal. I am muslim and i seek knowlege where ever i may find it. but not if its knowlege that satan uses to illude me from the truth
Mar 14, 2012
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starstarstarstar 		The truth of Freemasonry is....
by: Tim

Freemasonry is simply a system of moral teachings designed to enable a good man to make of himself a better man through study and introspection. It is not a religion. It has no evil in it. It has no more power than the golden rule: "Do unto others as you would have them do unto you."

The Masonic fraternity is an organization made up of men and women who desire to contribute to the betterment of the world, and realize that their contribution can be enhanced by combining efforts with many others. They work together in groups large and small to raise funds for worthy charitable organizations, to do charitable acts for those in need, and to support each other emotionally and spiritually in their daily lives.

Freemasonry and the Masonic fraternity combine to create a belief system and means by which to live a life of honor and purpose. Those who sensationalize it are either misinformed or are pursuing their own agenda toward profit or attention. As in most cases, the truth is much less exciting than the fiction.
Mar 31, 2012
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starstarstarstarstar 		then why is it secret
by: mjsearch4truth

@ tim, then y is it secret and concealed knowlege? Islam has all of those attributes, and it is free for the world to get anytime it wants to. y do u guys get a quran at a certain level of ur learning? what is a shrinner? and is the propaganda about blood sacrefice in the entertainment and political industry fake or real. the symbol are constant among them? talk to me now!!???
Apr 01, 2012
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starstarstarstarstar 		propaganda
by: MyOwnThinker

guess you answered your own question,,
PROPOGANDA : Information, of a biased or misleading nature
my opinion is that people need to stop restricting their mind and do some proper research before they slander,,
educate yourself and not from rappers and youtube.
i used to be anti mason but that was only because i was listening to what people were telling me and just watching propoganda.
but now that i have started thinking for myself all i can say is i do not have enough knowledge to clearly stste what is what, inshallah i would like to gain knowledge. but until i clearly know enough, i wouldd hate to slander when i dont have the knowledge.
Apr 02, 2012
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starstarstarstarstar 		Masonic secrets are....
by: Tim

The teachings of Freemasonry are not secret. They never have been. They are universal teachings for living a peaceful life of honor and service. Freemasonry simply uses the tools of operative masonry as symbols to serve as lifelong reminders of these lessons.

However, membership in the Masonic fraternity is restricted to those men who have been properly vouched for, satisfactorily investigated, and favorably balloted on by members of a regular lodge. Once made a member, we take upon ourselves certain obligations. These obligations are honorable promises of mutual assistance and support, dedications of service to mankind, and promises to keep certain secrets. They are decidedly not of a nature from which any good man would dissent. These obligations and the shared experience of initiation create the brotherhood that is the Freemasons.

The secrets are our modes of recognition and esoteric knowledge, by which we may come to know a man to be a brother. The Masonic fraternity is a worldwide organization and our secrets enable us to recognize each other without need of a formal introduction.

We do not receive a Quran, nor any other Holy book as part of being a Mason. Freemasonry is not a religion. Nor is it a substitute for religion. Every member is encouraged to practice his own chosen religion. Freemasonry only requires that a man believe in God. How he chooses to relate to and worship God is a personal matter.

A Shriner is a member of the Shriners International organization, an appendant body of Freemasonry. The Shrine is a philanthropic organization which supports several hospitals for children specializing in orthapaedics, burn care, cleft lip and palate, and spinal cord injury. You can learn more about the Shrine at www.ShrinersHQ.org

There is no sacrifice, blood or otherwise, in Freemasonry. We invest our time and money is service to others and becoming better men. Anyone willing to make such a sacrifice for personal gain, or for any other reason, has no place in the Masonic fraternity.

I hope this helps answer your questions and clear up some confusion. Thanks for your contribution to Masonsmart.com

Fraternally,

Tim
Apr 21, 2012
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starstarstar 		Sorcery , murder , interest in business , gambling , hoarding , alcohol..
by: Ibrahim Tamanrasetti

May our brother humans say that they believe in Supreme being , that word " Supreme Being " refers clearly to making yourself superior over other humans while you take them other humans including Muslims as some sort of stray animals say sheep or rabbits.
My brother Muslims dont add anybody amongst you or yourselves in Masonry because you will lose the help of Allah , he wants you to think of him , love him , care his command , read his words , fast for showing loyalty , pray 5 or more times , what else is important for you more that his great Paradise? Where four seasons dont exist , where sun never burns , where birds talk to you..
My brothers now lets get real , Masons were partly Christians but then they parted it for protection of Jerusalem. They do sorcery , that Haram . They dont actually trust in any God.
Follow up , discover their behaviour , they drink alcohol , take interests over loans , they put monopoly on businesses by killing rivals. They have zero tolerance , on wealth equality , religion , social harmony and their faces show that they are demons.

FYI: None of this regarding Masons or Masonry is true, and Ibrahim knows not of what he speaks.
Tim
Jun 26, 2012
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starstarstarstarstar 		truth
by: Anonymous

yes you can im one been one for over 30yrs
Sep 17, 2012
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starstarstarstarstar 		Muslim and Mason
by: rrl

as salam aleicum, let me add my personal take. I'm a Muslim and a Mason of Lodge in France, Member of a Master Lodge and yes it took me a while to get my head clear and Allah help me it was not easy. However may I say that while there is Rituals there is no Religion, no one ever argued about or against my believe in Allah. It is however difficult. It is not only the misconceptions and misinformation which is out there, you can get confused when you do not have a guiding hand and do not have a strong knowledge of Allah. Many fall from the path and it is dangerous for those who are easily swayed, for those strong enough the rewards are high and you will find many who will help you.
Allah keep you safe!
Oct 23, 2012
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starstarstarstarstar 		no need to be a mason
by: malik el allah

if you are a muslim ahki you dont need to be a mason.you will lose allah and allah will lose you. there is no need for masons. study about masons and see where they got started. peace brother
Nov 07, 2012
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star 		I am a nobody.
by: Nil

Peace be upon you,

I heard that for somebody to enter this fraternity, he must pass certain requirements. Can somebody with extremely low level of social status, wealth, knowledge or even has imperfect health be able to join this type of organisation?

Furthermore, this person even agnostic or an atheist with only the "niat" an great interest to find knowledge, which he hope could help him in the search for truth? Give a case that this person is an ex-Muslim and has always been a Muslim before.

Is this kind of person would able to join such fraternity?

Regards,
Ahmad
Nov 24, 2012
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starstarstarstarstar 		Allah will loose you
by: rrl

Malik el Allah, Allah will not loose you, loosing Allah is a personal decision and if you are secure in your knowledge of allah nothing will sway you from the path. I understand where freemasons came from and yes there is no need for them as there is no need for a lot of things when it comes down to the basics but Allah did put you in a family, a society and a now and learning is a big tenant of the Muslim faith. Some learning is more difficult than other and you add more knowledge at a price but never will Allah loose you when you stick to your faith. The base is to know Allah the Merciful!

On the question of membership and agnostic, may Allah be Merciful to him and let him find the path.

Membership is usually by invitation only, you have 2 sponsors and you go through a period of learning and progress from stage to stage. While good moral standing is a requirement, Masons are generally not richer than non-masons. I have not found many agnostics or atheists in the freemasons,the way to full membership is often challenging, especially for a muslim who has to find a way to understand "form".

Religious proselythism is frowned upon, at least I have not found any within my lodge.

I would not send a searching soul to the Masons and not someone who is set in his ways.

Walk your Path in Allah and be open to learn, listen to Allah when Shaitan crosses your way and you will be able to prevail. Temptation will cross your path at all times in all shapes and it is your task not to fail in the face of temptation. Theorie will not help you in this Case, only you walking yourself with Allah in your life will allow to maintain the good conduct in the face of Quran.

So like I said before a Freemason Lodge is not for the Muslim who is still searching or is not stabil in his faith. Freemasonry is not a religion, there is no rule against Islam.
Dec 04, 2012
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starstarstarstarstar 		Deception
by: Ali Al Abdullah

Assalamueleikum wa rahmatullahi wa barackatu. Do not associate any partners with Allah (s.w.t).The man who worships two masters at two dsifferent temples is doomed in this life and damned in the next.
Dec 09, 2012
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starstarstarstarstar 		do not limit Allah
by: rrl

Ali Al Abdullah,

don't you think that restricting Allah is a little bit outside of the scope of humanity? Being a Freemason will not make you worshipping 2 masters, they are neither a religion nor do they ask you to turn away from Allah, in contrary faith is valued highly and putting out a helping hand to humanity is not frowned upon in the Quran. Faith and worship are valued but outside the scope of freemasonry, they are your personal responsibility. Religion and politics are subjects which it is well known are stringently forbidden to be introduced into Masonry.

Dec 15, 2012
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starstarstarstarstar 		Muslim v Freemasons
by: Fred

Good evening

This is a extremely interesting topic for me as a person. I feel there is always a need to discuss with others ideas apart from religion. Such as one goes to a club / business links to meet and discuss various areas of life, business etc...

But my confusion is and I hope the Freemason contributors can help me to understand if the Freemasons are in a sense a "club"? Or are there religious aspects which collide with ones faith I.e Islam

I don't want to cause a outcry from fellow Muslims but I think I am allowed to ask questions and I hope I can get a answer from the Freemason community.

Regards



Dec 16, 2012
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starstarstarstarstar 		Freemasonry is not a Religion
by: ni seag

Basic Principles. Freemasonry is not a religion, nor is it a substitute for religion. It requires of its members a belief in God as part of the obligation of every responsible adult, but advocates no sectarian faith or practice. Masonic ceremonies include prayers, both traditional and extempore, to reaffirm each individual's dependence on God and to seek divine guidance. Freemasonry is open to men of any faith, but religion may not be discussed at Masonic meetings.

The Supreme Being. Masons believe that there is one God and that people employ many different ways to seek, and to express what they know of God. Masonry primarily uses the appellation, "Grand Architect of the Universe," and other non-sectarian titles, to address the Deity. In this way, persons of different faiths may join together in prayer, concentrating on God, rather than differences among themselves. Masonry believes in religious freedom and that the relationship between the individual and God is personal, private, and sacred.

Volume of the Sacred Law. An open volume of the Sacred Law, "the rule and guide of life," is an essential part of every Masonic meeting. The Volume of the Sacred Law in the Judeo/Christian tradition is the Bible; to Freemasons of other faiths, it is the book held holy by them.

The Oath of Freemasonry. The obligations taken by Freemasons are sworn on the Volume of the Sacred Law. They are undertakings to follow the principles of Freemasonry and to keep confidential a Freemason's means of recognition. The much discussed "penalties," judicial remnants from an earlier era, are symbolic, not literal. They refer only to the pain any honest man should feel at the thought of violating his word.

Freemasonry Compared with Religion. Freemasonry lacks the basic elements of religion: (a) It has no dogma or theology, no wish or means to enforce religious orthodoxy. (b) It offers no sacraments. (c) It does not claim to lead to salvation by works, by secret knowledge, or by any other means. The secrets of Freemasonry are concerned with modes of recognition, not with the means of salvation.

Freemasonry Supports Religion. Freemasonry is far from indifferent toward religion. Without interfering in religious practice, it expects each member to follow his own faith and to place his Duty to God above all other duties. Its moral teachings are acceptable to all religions.
Dec 25, 2012
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starstarstarstarstar 		don't become one
by: Anonymous

subhan-allah you are a muslim there is no need for you to become one.

May Allah guide you to the right path
Jan 19, 2013
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starstarstarstarstar 		dnt b stupid people.
by: Anonymous

The worst thing U could ever do, sell your soul to the devil. I thank the Al-Mighty Allah for saving me from selling my soul to the devil. Satan plays so many tricks with you. I was an ignorant Muslim when I joined, but something kept showing me this is wrong. If it wasn't for me meeting this Muslim man from Cyprus. I would have sold my soul and would have been among the cursed ones. Masonary is all about worshiping the Satan. And masonsry is all about deception. Just the same way Adam and Eve where tricked into eating an apple from the forbidden Tree. And a Muslim can NEVER BE A MASON AND MUSLIM.as a Muslim U live to build ur afterlife not ur worldly life. Either be a good Muslim, good heart, good intention, pray five times. N remember ur Creator. Not no supreme being. We know our creator thru the beloved Muhammad S.A.W. The best of examples. Just ask urself if the prophet was stood here n U said U wanted to become a mason?? U wudnt wud U so there's ur answer. Bad times are coming. I cannot beleive people would actually fall for this. We live in such a brainwashed society. We go to forums on the net for to get our questions answered. It could be anyone behind the screen. N lastly. Tim who are U trying to kid. Go on YouTube and type masons confessing, ex masons. So they're all lying now. Everyone wake up before ots to late. The Satan mankinds enemy..
Mar 20, 2013
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starstarstarstarstar 		new muslim mason
by: Muslim Mason

I am proud to be a muslim and have recently joined the free Masons, i was confronted buy a few close family members in doing so, but when i read more about it i understood afterall, freemasons are not evil devil worshippers etc inface in their membership form it even mentions if u beleive in a supreme creator such as GOD / ALLAH...!!!
Apr 11, 2013
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starstarstarstarstar 		I'm a Muslim and a Freemasons.
by: Muhamad Yaakub

Assalammualaikum my Muslim Brothers.

As a Muslim, I am obligated to answer some of your answers regarding Freemasonry. I could assure you in the name of Allah S.W.T, there is nothing wrong with freemasonry. It is compatible with Islam in anyway. Freemasonry could not only help me to know myself, but also to do good deeds, promote truth and happiness within the boundaries of Islam.

At first, I was hesitated to join this Fraternity as some of you did encouraged me before that Freemasonry is worshipping the devil. Those rumor's are not true. Freemasonry is not a religion, but to become one, you need to have your own religion, and mine, Islam.

In Islam, we were thought that Fitna is a greater sin than Murder, so, as a Muslim Brother, I advice you to carefully measure your words, especially within topic that you've known nothing about.

Regards,
Apr 21, 2013
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starstarstarstarstar 		the comments refering to Sheikh Imran Hosein
by: ni seag

Sheikh Imran Hosein comments are showing not knowledge but the pursuit of old conspiracy theory and propaganda.

Do your own homework and look at reality, not at someones theories.

and read up on Abdelkader El Djezairi
Jun 27, 2013
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starstarstarstarstar 		From Freemasonry to Islam
by: Najim

Dear Brothers,

Thanks to Freemasonry, I discovered Islam, Mashallah.
I am now a proud Muslim and my faith helps me understand better Freemasonry since I converted.

Freemasonry is not a religion but a great complement to religion. It acts as a lever for religion.

Freemasonry is absolutely not secret! We believe in one God and do charity and are very open. Just go to your nearby Masonic Lodge and ask for a visit. It will dissipate the veil of ignorance.

I love my Brother Masons and my Brother Muslims.

Salam

Bro. Najim
Jun 30, 2013
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starstarstar 		QUIERO SABER SI PUEDO SER MASON
by: C. ALBERTO

1.-¿UN MEXICANO PUEDE SER MASON?
2.-¿QUE REQUISITOS NECESITO PARA SER MASON?
3.-EN MEXICO EXISTEN MASONES Y ELLOS PUEDEN INFORMARNOS?
Jul 06, 2013
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starstarstarstarstar 		Mexican Masons
by: ni seag

sure, look these up:
Gran Capítulo de Masones del Real Arco de México
Gran Consejo de Masones Crípticos de México
Gran Comandancia de los Estados Unidos Mexicanos

http://www.yorkmexico.org/inicio.php
Jul 07, 2013
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starstarstarstarstar 		Grand Lodge Valle de Mexico
by: Tim

And below is the Web address for the Grand Lodge Valle de Mexico Web site.

http://www.mrglvm.org/index1.html

Best regards and good fortune in your journey,

Tim
Aug 07, 2013
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starstarstarstarstar 		Dont do it if you are a true muslim. Contradiction.
by: Anonymous

Masons worship the sun. The sun is the eastern star. When the world was in darkness God said let there be light. Masons always talk about enlightenment. The angel who tryed to overthrow God was the most beautiful angel which was Gods right hand man. That angel was Lucipher. The wordif looked up in the dictionary means light bearer or enlughtened one. Lucipher provided light to the world when God said let there be light. This was the same serpent who talked eve into eating from the tree of knowledge. This is the same serpent used as a symbol in medical fields as acknowledgement of that field. The sun rises to the east . Lucipher is the sun. Most masons we know are not on the level high enough to even know the truth of the organization. They talk brotherhood and fellowship but they are just pawns who dont know the real mission of freemasonry. Masory has been infiltrated by illuminist who have another agenda. One world rule.
Aug 08, 2013
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		For my Muslim brother ASAK
by: Anonymous

ASAK Wow my Muslim brother your comment was very interesting . I am practicing Muslim and a 32 degree master mason. I can assure you that the information that you just stated is very off based. So if all mason are evil and worship the devil. That mean a great many of Muslim leader such as Yasser Arafat for example who was a 33rd master mason. Is a devil worshiper??? This man spent his life fighting for the rights of people until the day Allah (swa) sent the two angels to bring him back to his creator . So brother I'm as high as you can go as Mason. There is only one degree left that I can earn. There is no devil worship going on in Freemason. :-) Ramandan Kareem
Aug 26, 2013
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		Albert Pike the most famous Mason
by: Anonymous

This is part am excerpt from a letter that Albert Pike wrote. "That which we must say to the crowd is - we worship a God, but it is the God that one adores without superstition. To you, Sovereign Grand Inspectors General (of the 33rd degree), we say this, that you may repeat it to the brethren of the 32nd , 31st and 30th degrees - The Masonic Religion should be, by all of us initiates of the high degrees, maintained in the purity of the Luciferian doctrine.

If Lucifer were not God, would Adonay, the God of the Christians, whose deeds prove his cruelty, perfidy and hatred of man, barbarism and repulsion for science, would Adonay and his priests calumniate him? Yes, Lucifer is God, and unfortunately Adonay is also God. For the eternal law is that there is no light without shade, no beauty without ugliness, no white without black, for the absolute can only exist as two Gods: darkness being necessary to light to serve as its foil as the pedestal is necessary to the statue, and the brake to the locomotive." To say that Masons are not of the luciferian doctrine and that they do not worship Lucifer, is misleading and frankly a lie. If you believe this then it is because you are a low level mason. My Muslim brothers, do not fall for the lies of shaytan.
Aug 29, 2013
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		sin
by: Anonymous

Any muslim who knowingly becomes a mason is under islamic law guilty of commiting shirk.
Aug 31, 2013
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		The "Luciferian Doctrine" hoax
by: Tim

Dear Anonymous regarding Albert Pike,

The supposed excerpt that you provide above is a part of what is called the "Luciferian Doctrine." This episode which purported that Lucifer was the God of
Masonry was a hoax created by Léo Taxil (Gabriel Antoine Jogand-Pagès) in
the late 1800's. While he publically confessed to the hoax in 1897 people
did, and still do, belive it and repeat it without going to the trouble to
verify it. Over the past 100+ years many authors have fallen prey to the temptation to publish this proven hoax as truth without doing a whif of research to verify it. Welcome to the club.

If you are interested in the truth here is a Web link for the story of the hoax including sources:

Is It True What They Say About Freemasonry?

And, here is a link to a full reproduction of Taxil's confession to the
hoax:

Leo Taxil's confession to the Luciferian Doctrine hoax against Freemasonry.

Of course, if your interests lie only in slandering Freemasonry with false accusations without regard for truth then nothing I, or anyone else, may say will change that.

Thank you for visiting Masonsmart,

Tim
Aug 31, 2013
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		Sin?
by: ni seag

See that somone believes that Muslim Freemasons are commiting shirk. In Islam, shirk (Arabic: شرك‎ širk) refers to the sin of practicing idolatry or polytheism, i.e. the deification or worship of anyone or anything other than the singular God. Literally, it means the establishment of "partners" placed beside God.

Freemasons do not do that. The deepen the social understanding and responsibility but they neither tamper with the 5 pillars of islam nor do the set up idols or see themselves or anyone else as partner of Allah.
Sep 09, 2013
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		Yes you can be a mason and a muslim
by: Anonymous

My bro
You can be a mason and a muslim in the mean time
I am a mason
And iam a muslim
You believe in god
You believe in prophets
Masons are a society not intefering with religons
Oct 01, 2013
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		masonry
by: Sari

-Bismi Allah Raham Rahim-
If they say that freemasonry its all about brotherhood and charity then where is the need to allied with them when Islam has already and even more... there is no point at all worship God and do what he says to do there in no need at ALL to join other kind of groups regardless of what they teach....
Oct 01, 2013
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starstarstarstarstar 		whats the problem
by: Anonymous

what is the problem, all we say is that you can be a muslim and a freemason, we never said you have to be, there are many groups which are charitable and looking out for the betterment of humanity. You can be a solitary muslim and you can be a social muslim or in between, but engaging society is part of islam and so complimentary membership is allowed as long as you are not going against the pillars of islam.
Oct 14, 2013
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starstarstarstarstar 		Muslim masons in North America
by: 32 ldegree mason

.i as a mason would welcome any one of any faith into my lodge.
The problem I see with Muslims being masons is fairly involved. First Muslims hate and dispise democracy. This in itself is enough to eliminate you from the free world masonic lodges, as we promise to never go against our country or government.
The basic tenets of Islam are all anti democracy and free world. Why would a Muslim even want to join a fraternity that is opposite his beliefs.
Seems to me a little strange
Oct 14, 2013
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starstarstarstarstar 		Can't see it happening
by: Anonymous

The freemasons accept everyone from any faith into their lodges. The Muslim would be able to join.
I see an issue here though , Muslims hate democracy as described in the Koran . It goes against one of their most sacred beliefs. My question is why would a practicing muslim do this. It is very hypicritical to be praying for one thing and then taking vows not to go against your government. Which in North America is a democracy.
So that in itself seems strange That a Muslim to promise to Allah one thing then turn around and promise the opposite to god.
Seems maybe this young man has other motives, or is just very confused
Oct 14, 2013
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		All seems like roses
by: Anonymous

My problem is the ambiguity of professing love for Allah and the quoran
And taking vows to protect country and govt with the masons.
When the quoran clearly states it's hatred for democracy. This is entry level question time.
What's it gonna be, one or the other. It cannot be both
Oct 15, 2013
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		Confusion
by: Tim

Dear Anonymous "32 ldegree mason,"

First, America is not a democracy. We are a republic.

Second, please direct us to the portion of the Quran that describes Islam's hatred of democracy.

Third, the obligations of Blue Lodge Freemasonry say nothing about not going against the government. The history of our war for independence, the framing of our constitution, and the formation of our constitutional government all included dedicated patriots, freedom-fighters, and Freemasons. Being a Freemason does not bind one to blindly obey the government. In fact, quite the opposite. In the additional bodies of the Scottish Rite we are taught to battle tyranny wherever we find it, even in our own house.

Fourth, why do you refer to God and Allah as two separate entities? Do you believe in more than one supreme being? There is only one. We may call Him by different names; we may worship Him in different manners; we may relate to Him in different ways, but there is only one.

I can not help but wonder who it is that is confused.
Oct 21, 2013
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		thats right
by: Niseag

Tim is right, in all my time in Grand Oriente and our associated Master Lodge I have not seen a non-compatibility with my faith and I am a Moslem and Sufi (my Sheik belonged to the Naqshibandi in Peshawar and yes I did run it by him). Shukri Abed wrote a nice article summoning the discussion paramenters of Democracy and Islam, there are other papers, I myself believe that Democracy and Faith have to come together, just the plain old Democracy will not serve Humanity and in that there are a lot of Freemasons who share that sentiment.
Mar 03, 2014
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starstarstarstarstar 		Bad deeds under freemansoniry
by: Darko

Great topic.

I am a born ortodox christian and lived in place of earth where Islam was presented as a very bad thing (considering history of wars that took place in past) until one night I had a vision and read Kuran in my dream. Then i looked for it and since then I realized the truth.

Since I have been witness of all bad things that happened to people in my former country where unseen forces used most sacred values of Religion (regardless of domination it was just a matter of which one was more prominent in population) I can not help my self noticing that people who took place in all those bad deeds where actually Masons accepted in lodge.

That gave me doubts about Freemasons in general. I understand that I should not make general opinions but...

Anyway who ever gave answers here to our brothers muslims who had little knowledge but lot of fears did a good thing. Rare to find online.

Regards
Mar 25, 2014
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		knowledge
by: brother Richardson(mm)

Im a god fearing man and a master mason, i feel anything that can make you a better as a person husband,father, wife, as an individual man or women.seek that knowledge whether its in islam,masonry,christianity,buddaism,or judaism.All praises due to the creator.knowledge comes from reading instead of speaking.you are the ship but the al-mighty is the caption of All OUR SHIPS!!!!!!!!!!.somotobe
Mar 25, 2014
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		Very well put brother
by: Anonymous

So mote it be!
Mar 25, 2014
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		Very well put brother
by: Anonymous

So mote it be!
Mar 31, 2014
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starstarstarstarstar 		I don't see any harm.
by: Anonymous

Salamalakum fellow brother & sisters,

I met a mason Muslim person. Strong faith, daily prayers, goes to Friday Jumah, what is honestly wrong? He's more Muslim than I am mashallah and an excellent role model. I'm 25 and interested in the mason organization solely only because the benefits of title & helping the fellow man or woman. They don't condone haram, interfere with your belief practice, or discuss politics.

I should also strongly mention they only accept applicants whom believe only single faith (mono theism religion). They don't allow the discussion of religions or politics within the organization for a reason. Simply put, it's to better one's self, not walking a dark path away from SWT Allah. I've been researching them for almost 5 years all I see is conspiracy theorists making them look bad.
Apr 11, 2014
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starstarstarstarstar 		Muslim Mason
by: Anonymous

If a Muslim joins a group such as the Freemasons, doesn't it go against the Islamic concept of Al Wala' Wal Bara'?
Apr 11, 2014
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		Al Wala Wal Bara
by: Ni Seag

Al Wala' Wal Bara' means, on one hand, drawing near to what is pleasing to Allah and His Messenger and, on the other hand, withdrawing from what is displeasing to Allah and His Messenger. A very good book on thaat matter can be found at http://www.kalamullah.com/Books/alWalaawalBaraa1.pdf

And no, Freemasonry is not against the Faith because the Masons will not dispute your faith, nor hinder its expression in word, action or prayer, but will support it.
Apr 11, 2014
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		Al walaa wal baraa
by: Anonymous

Thank you for the extremely informative link on the topic. I suggest every Muslim, whether part of the FreeMasons or not, should read it.

Regards.
Apr 16, 2014
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		I wanna be a mason
by: Muneera

Hi everyone..
My name is muneera 18 years old and I really wanna be a mason can someone help me?

Email:[email protected]

Thankyou..:)
Apr 21, 2014
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		Membership
by: Ni Seag

Really depends where you are, not every lodge is open to female members
Jul 05, 2014
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starstarstarstarstar 		Don't join them, be friends, or be unaware of Masons around u!
by: Anonymous

Every Mason that I know and I know a few , inwardly and outwardly express there hatred for all religions. If you become one of them you will knowingly or unknowingly be helping them to destroy our ummah. Mason infiltrate faith's, pollute them with paganism and idols, then dub them a new title creating various sects.
Jul 07, 2014
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starstarstarstarstar 		Answer can you leave?
by: Amir

1/The Entered Apprentice degree

2/The Fellow Craft degree

3/The Master Mason degree

Above are the first,second and third degrees that One goes through before becoming a Freemason i.e. "the master mason"

Answer: You can NOT leave freemasonry when you reach "3/The Master Mason degree"

The last opportunity to leave is when your a 2/The Fellow Craft degree. that is FACT my Muslims brothers.

Notice, the Freemasons in this forum whom "claim" to be Muslim state:

"I'm a Freemason and a Muslim"

your answer: this sentiment states they put freemasonry first and Islam second.

Islam is second to none my brothers.

Allah is second to none my brothers.

These people are not Muslim, some of them may truly believe they are.Allah is must merciful and forgiving, may he forgive and genuinely enlighten those whom believe in Allah and Muhammad (PBUH): صلى الله عليه وسلم

If you are a Muslim you must not join Freemasonry. Very simple, you already know this.

Islam will offer you everything, freemasonry cant.

Those in the Blue lodges are deprived from the truth.

Lots of freemasonry are every good people, but we are at war with these societies and organizations of secret proceedings and demonic agenda and world governance, we have know this 1.800 years ago.

(**No True Muslim should "EVER" considering actively joining nor participation**).

Number 1 in your life and the hereafter is Allah.

You truly want your answer: use your conscience to give you your answer. Allah has taken away the conscience of Freemasons.

Freemasonry swear to believe in a supreme being a one monolithic god, they truly believe in the blue lodges, they have been taken astray.My god guide them back to the righteous path and give them truth in knowledge.

My muslams brothers and Sisters.
سلام عليكم) As-salamu alaykum

Amir
Jul 08, 2014
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		so much lack of knowledge
by: Ni Seag

Amir,

When talking about a subject you put that first, we are talking about Freemasons, do not give the grammar more meaning than it has, Allah comes first, and Freemasons understand that. It is a given and not talked about, in fact it is a matter which is not up for discussion and yes you can leave the Lodge any time for any reason, there is no such restriction in the by-laws (would be illegal anyway)
Jul 08, 2014
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starstarstarstarstar 		Politics and religion
by: Anonymous

Ni Seag,

Unfortunately it’s not up for discussion as one of the laws within any given recognised Lodge is a restriction of speaking about politics and religion respectfully. It’s important to examine the grammar in every sense, not to scrutinise it, however as to correctly determine its message.

Members of the order, can change lodges anytime, i.e. leave one lodge for another. You can be affiliated with more than one lodge also. But you can’t leave once you are a master mason, that information was stated by a grand master in one of the oldest "grand lodges" in the world.
Jul 08, 2014
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		actually
by: Niseag

The procedure to renounce Freemasonry is simple. Simply notify the members of the lodge in writing, stating that you are renouncing Freemasonry and tell them in clear terms that you never want anything to do with it now, or at any time in the future. Tell them you no longer are a Mason. They have no legal, moral or other means to compel you to continue. In addition no one compels you to go there.

There have been Masons, yes also Master Masons, leaving their Lodges and Freemasonry all together. There have been Christians who left for the same reason some Muslims bring up. The argument is old and goes back to a specific reading of texts.
You find a discussion here:
http://www.blessedquietness.com/journal/housechu/masndmit.htm
Jul 14, 2014
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starstarstarstarstar 		Democracy
by: Anonymous

Islam is a democratic belief system, where we all have an equal say.. There are many extremist that judges everyone who is not muslim, when Nabi (S.A.W) lived amoungst jews and christians and did not persecute them for their beliefs.. Yes there were battles aswell, but it was because they sought to destroy the prophet.. Today muslims are disgracing Islam by mistreating those who do not follow Islam.. I say that Allah has given us free will and we should not judge each other because "you shall be judged as you judge others" if the masons truely respect each others beliefs like they say then they have followed a command of Allah and Nabi (s.a.w), until i know the truth about them, i will not judge.. Allah knows best
Jul 31, 2014
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		No.....way
by: Zahra

To all muslims be carefull with this kind people people are jas after money its no longer a secreat its not a religion...realy then what the hell are they doing rituals we been warned that hypocrets will be among us ther right here trying excuse what there doing its not right and it will never be but they ll always be those who are hungry for money they do anything for it
Jul 31, 2014
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starstarstarstarstar 		ahem
by: Niseag

so only after the money? I did not see that one coming, read the facts and experience reality, following conspiracy theories will not help you on the path of Islam
Aug 01, 2014
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		4ever learning
by: Anonymous

Hello to all,

If you are Muslim and you take part in prayer in a Masonic hall, do you face the direction of Qiblah? What do you recite in your prayers? Do you all pray in the same way at the same time? Is there a prayer leader? Is there a prayer structure?

Why is the Made in Australia sign within a pyramid shape?
Why is the Made in New Zealand sign within a pyramid shape?

Thank you in advance
Aug 02, 2014
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starstarstarstarstar 		Freemasonry does not violate Islam
by: Anonymous

Freemasons say, having trust in God fear not what man can do to you. Freemasonry encourages whatever faith you have. I am Mohammad Faisel Khan and i am a very high level mason
Aug 02, 2014
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		hm
by: Niseag

we have a separate prayer room with all the facilities and its built to specs for muslim prayer, know quite a few who have that but also some who don't, which is no problem for them since they have no muslim members
Aug 03, 2014
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		Islam & Freemsaonry
by: 4ever learning

Hello to all,

From what you have described this sounds like a version of zikr?
During Ramadan do you visit the Masonic hall instead of attending the Taraweh prayer?
Do you visit the Masonic hall instead of any of the 5 prayers?
What are we to gain from praying with people who are not Muslim and do not believe in the Quran?
What are we to gain from collaborating with non Muslims inside these halls?

Thank you in advance
Aug 03, 2014
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		why
by: Niseag

You do not go to the Lodge for Prayer, the room and facility for the islamic prayer is for the members to use when they are there and you want to pray as advised.
Aug 04, 2014
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		4ever learning
by: Anonymous

Hello to all,
I am trying to understand although I don't seem to be receiving much substance from the answers posted.

Are the Druids the first account of Freemasons?

What are your thoughts on the illuminati?

Thank you in advance
Aug 04, 2014
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		?
by: Niseag

where are you coming from? Druids have nothing to do with Freemasonry and the Illuminaty while using the same structure were very far away from Freemasons, while there very cross roads the core is very different.
Aug 05, 2014
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		4ever learning
by: Anonymous

Hello to all,

So would you say the illuminati is to freemasonry as to what Zionism is to jewdaism?
How does the illuminati differ from freemasonry?

Thank you in advance
Aug 07, 2014
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		4ever learning
by: Anonymous

Just read an interesting part in the Quran that made me think of this page and to get some answers from what islamic Freemasons think.
Surah 3, section 19, part 187
Bismillah:
"And remember Allah took a covenant from the people of the book, to make it known and clear to mankind, and not to hide it; But they threw it away behind their backs, and purchased with it some miserable gain! And vile was the bargain they made!"

My interpretation of being a person of the book, it is our job not to hide our belief or the revelations revealed to us. To make our beliefs and intention clear to mankind. I believe freemasonry to be in breach of this. As nothing about freemasonry is clear or known to mankind.

Interested in your thoughts.

Thanking you in advance
Aug 07, 2014
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		freemasonry
by: amba

Im amba,im a filipino muslim from philippines. Im willing to join mason not to surrender my religion to mason.because it is very clear that a freemason is not a religion.thank you
Aug 07, 2014
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		Common confusion
by: Tim

4ever learning,
You seem to be confusing Freemasonry with Religion. It is not a religion, nor is it to be a substitute for religion. It has no dogma; it offers no path to salvation. It is only religious in nature in that Freemasonry encourages its members to follow the religious faith of their choosing.

There is nothing about Freemasonry that is unclear or unknown. Even our 'secrets' are easily found online. Freemasons have endeavored to explain Freemasonry for centuries, and continue to do so to this day. The conspiracy theorists, scammers and anti-Masons muddy the waters to the point that Freemasons are reduced to trying to prove a negative. How do we prove the things said about us are untrue to those unwilling to find out for themselves. Conspiracy theories are interesting, exciting, intriguing; the truth often is not.

I also find your choice of terms in an earlier post interesting. When you ask, "What are we to gain from collaborating with non Muslims inside these halls?" The only collaboration among Freemasons is to help, aid and assist our neighbor, community, and by extention the whole of mankind. The Masonic fraternity is not a religious organization; it is a social organization. Is it your contention that followers of one religion can gain nothing through social interaction with those of another?

Thank you for your questions.
Aug 09, 2014
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		4ever learning
by: Anonymous

Tim,
Well said and nice try. You almost had me until I noticed a common theme.
1. There were no answers to my questions.
2. You seemed to read off the same script as previous posters regarding conspiracies, we are not a religion etc etc.
3. No explanation when the Quran is quoted.

Okay so freemasonry is here to make us a better whatever religion we are. Good stuff but this is where it gets interesting..... For us to be Freemasons and better our religious beliefs we have to apply and wait to maybe be excepted. And if excepted we have to pay money to join. What? Who are you to judge whether I am able to improve my religious beliefs and understanding? And who are you to charge me for wanting to do so? Guess what buddy it ain't up to you and you old dudes in weird gowns to determine how far my religious beliefs and journey expands, Astaghfurallah for thinking you have the power and right to do so! How could you believe in this?

If you guys were really to improve everyones belief in religion you would except people no matter whom and what! Not only select the 'prime' examples! And would not charge for this either!

You also stated:
"The only collaboration among Freemasons is to help, aid and assist our neighbor, community, and by extention the whole of mankind. The Masonic fraternity is not a religious organization; it is a social organization. Is it your contention that followers of one religion can gain nothing through social interaction with those of another?"

This is all correct, help our neighbour and community. But how are you helping and in what way? Helping your own agenda when you gather inside secret halls with a secret membership which you have to be excepted into? And sounds oddly like the foundations of most religious beliefs. But you guys aren't a religion right? Who are you trying to confuse now?

If you guys are really here to improve religious beliefs, where did the Freemason teachings originate from?
Aug 09, 2014
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		Truth does not change
by: Tim

4ever learning,
Thank you, but what does it mean that I almost had you, and for what purpose would I want to get you?

1. Regarding no answers to your questions. My apologies. I was responding to your most recent post and then strayed into an earlier one that I found interesting. So, let me see if I can help.

I believe Niseag has answered your questions regarding Muslim prayer within a Masonic hall.

"Why is the Made in Australia sign within a pyramid shape?"
The pyramid shape is not a Masonic symbol. The symbol we use is the equalateral triangle. The meanings of this shape as a symbol are many: equalateral because all men are created equal; because equal distribution of weight (or load) results in the strongest possible structure; three sides to represent the three degrees of Masonry, the three principle officers of a lodge, the three stages of life, youth, manhood and age. However, the Masonic fraternity does not own any of its symbols including the triangle. They are used as teaching instruments. They represent ideas and as symbols they impress these ideas upon the heart and mind more readily than spoken or written word. As to why the Made in Australia sign is within a pyramid shape, you'd have to ask the designers of the logo. I have no idea.

Why is the Made in New Zealand sign within a pyramid shape?
Same answer, except that it doesn't really look like a pyramid to me. To me it looks more like an igloo, but that wouldn't really make sense for New Zealand. Maybe a cone-shaped hat?

Again. I think Niseag has succinctly answered your question regarding the Druids being the first account of Freemasons. Let me just add that the recorded history of Freemasonry goes back only a few centuries. Prior to that is legend made up of allegory, myth, and perhaps a sprinkling of actual history. No one knows for sure, including Freemasons.

Regarding the Illuminati: I have no thoughts on the Illuminati other than to say that if possible they have been even more abused by the conspiracy theorists and scammers than have the Masons. I am not an Illuminate, or whatever their membership is called. Therefore, for me to attempt to compare, contrast or in any way comment on their order would be comparable to a non-Mason expressing alledged knowledge of Freemasonry when they actually know nothing.

2. "You seemed to read off the same script as previous posters regarding conspiracies, we are not a religion etc etc."

We seem to be reading from the same script because truth does not change.

3. "No explanation when the Quran is quoted."

Freemasonry is not a religion, nor does it endorse or conflict with any religion. I don't know how to put it any plainer. It's a set of philosophical teachings. It simply encourages its members to faithfully practice the religion of their own choosing. That's it; that's all. That is the full and complete involvement of Freemasonry with religion.

Now, on to your most recent accusations because you no longer seem to be interested in learning, if indeed that was ever your true purpose in posting to this page.

It seems as if we're talking about two completely different subjects. I'm talking about the fraternal order of Freemasons, and I don't even recognize what you're talking about. Freemasonry is a set of philosophical teachings designed to assist a person in living a life of dignity and honor. It has no goal or purpose whatsoever regarding religious beliefs. There are religious leaders for that.

The Masonic fraternity is a private fraternal organization. We raise funds for charities; we do charitable works within our communities; we fund and operate hospitals and clinics. Our members are accepted based on the nature of their character and a freely expressed belief in the supreme being. As a private organization we retain the right to accept or reject petitioners based on these criteria. To do otherwise would be detrimental to the organization as a whole.

Further and of higher priority, Freemasons are expected to be able to support themselves and their family. Participation in the Masonic lodge takes time and money. A man who can ill afford to provide for his family and participate in lodge will be better off applying his time to the improvement of his circumstances.

The teachings of Freemasonry are nothing new or unique. They are philosophical teachings for an honorable life. Freemasonry simply uses the tools and emblems of operative stone masonry to teach and impress these lessons. You ask from where do they originate. To answer that question we would have to know from where did the notions of honor, honesty, dignity, compassion, charity, peace, harmony originate? My best guess would be that the teachings of Freemasonry originated with the first utterance of: "Do unto others as you would have others do unto you."

Bear in mind that no one speaks for Freemasonry. These are my own opinions based on study and years of pondering.

I don't know where you're getting your information regarding Freemasonry but it's twisted and skewed. Unfortunately, you seem more interested in attaching Freemasonry to religion than actually learning. Perhaps you're only misinformed; perhaps you have an agenda. I don't know which, but based on your last couple of posts I wonder if your handle, 4ever learning, shouldn't be changed to never listening.

Thank you for contributing to the discussion.
Aug 09, 2014
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		Muslim Freemason
by: Peter


- Basic Tenets of Faith » Schools of Thought and Religions.
ar
34576: Freemasonry and ruling on joining the Masons
What is Freemasonry, and what is the ruling on it in Islam? What is the ruling on joining the Masons?.
Praise be to Allaah.
Freemasonry is a secret political society whose goal is to put an end to all religions and good morals, and to replace them with man-made laws and non-religious systems. It strives to provoke ongoing revolutions and to replace one regime with another, on the basis of its call for freedom of thought and freedom of belief. This is what they have stated clearly.

This is what was announced by one of them in the Students’ Conference held in 1865 CE in the city of Liege which is considered to be one of the centers of Freemasonry. He said:

Man must prevail over God, and declare war on Him. He should demolish the heavens and tear them like paper.

It says in the Masonic Grand Lodge (1922, p. 98): We will strengthen the freedom of individual thought with all the powers at our disposal, and we will declare war against the real enemy of man, which is religion.

The Masons say that Masonry takes the human soul as its object of worship.

They say: It is not enough for us to prevail over the religious people and their places of worship, rather our basic goal is to wipe them out of existence.

Minutes of the World Masonic Conference, 1903 CE, p. 102.

They say: Freemasonry will take the place of religion and its Lodges will take the place of places of worship… and there are many other statements which clearly point to the intensity of their enmity towards religion and their uncompromising war on religion.

The Freemasons are one of the most ancient secret societies which still exist and its origins are still unknown to many people and are still unknown to many of their members, because the plots of their leaders are very secret and hidden and they are so keen to conceal their plots and aims. Therefore most of their affairs are conducted verbally, with no written record.

When they want to write an idea or announce it to the public, it is first subjected to the scrutiny of Masonic censors who decide whether it may be released or not. The foundations of Freemasonry were based on theories taken from several sources, mostly from Jewish traditions.

This is supported by the fact that Jewish ideas and teachings were taken as the basis for the founding of the Grand Lodge in 1717 CE with its principles and symbols. The Masons still venerate the Jew Hiram and the temple that he built, from which they take the design of the Masonic lodges in the world. The greatest Masonic leaders are Jews and form the backbone of the Masonic movement, and they are the ones who represent Jewish organizations in Masonic lodges. It is to them that the spread of Masonry and global cooperation between Freemasons is to be attributed. They are the driving force behind Freemasonry and this Jewish elite are leading different secret cells, running their affairs and directing them secretly as they wish. This is supported by a report in the Masonic Acacia magazine (1908, issue no. 66) which says that there is no Masonic lodge that is free of Jews and that all the Jews do not follow one way or another exclusively, rather there are only principles for them to follow. And this is also the case with the Masons. Hence the Jewish synagogues are our [Masons’] support and we find many Jews among the Freemasons.

This is also supported by what it says in the Masonic publications: that the Jews are certain that the best means of destroying religion is Freemasonry. The history of the Masons is similar to the history of the Jews in belief. Their symbol is the six-pointed Star of David. The Jews and the Freemasons both consider themselves to be the spiritual sons of the builders of the Temple of Solomon. The Freemasonry which distorts other religions lends full support to Judaism and its followers. The Jews took advantage of people’s simple-mindedness and good intentions, and infiltrated Freemasonry and reached high positions within it, thus they breathed a Jewish spirit into the Masonic lodges and subjugated them to their own aims.

One of the clearest indications of their intense desire to conceal their plans to destroy religions and provoke political revolutions is what it says in the Protocols of the Elders of Zion, where it says: we will concentrate these cells under a single leadership that is known to us alone. This leadership will be composed of our scholars and these cells will have special representatives, so that the true location of our leadership will be concealed. This leadership alone will have the right to decide who will speak, and to draw up the plans of the day. In these cells we will plan to lay traps for all the socialists and classes of revolutionary society. Most of the secret political plans are known to us and we will decide when to implement them. But the agents of the international secret police will be members of these cells. When the conspiracies start throughout the world, that will mean that one of our most dedicated agents will be at the head of these conspiracies and of course we will be the only people to direct the Masonic plans. We are the only people who know how to direct them and we know the ultimate goal of each action, whilst the illiterates – meaning non-Jews – are ignorant of most of these things, especially Masonry, and they can only see the immediate results of what they are doing.

And there is other evidence which points to the strong connection between the Jews and the Masons, and the cooperation between the two parties in revolutionary conspiracies and stirring up destructive movements. Even though Freemasonry outwardly appears to be a call to freedom of belief, tolerance and social reform in general, in fact it is really a call for permissiveness and destructive factors which cause social disintegration and the loosening of bonds between nations and destruction of religion and morals and the spread of mischief.

Based on this, any Muslim who joins a Masonic group knowing the true nature of Freemasonry and its secrets, and carries out its rituals and is keen to do so, is a kaafir who should be asked to repent. If he repents, all well and good, otherwise he is to be put to death and if he dies in that state then his recompense will be that of the kaafirs. Whoever joins the Freemasons but does not know what they really are, or know about their plots against Islam and the Muslims, and their spreading evil and the evil that they are planning against everyone who tries to bring people together and reform nations, and he joins them in their general activities and talk that does not apparently contradict Islam, is not a kaafir, rather he is excused in general because of their concealing their true nature from him, and because he does not share their basic beliefs or aims. The Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “Acts are but by intentions, and each man will have but that which he intended.”

But he must disavow himself of them when he finds out what they really are, and he must tell people about their real nature and strive to spread their secrets and their plots against the Muslims, so that this will cause a scandal for them and will undermine their efforts. The Muslim should surround himself with good people who will cooperate with him in his religious and worldly affairs. He should be far-sighted in choosing close friends so that he will be safe from being tempted by these apparently attractive ideas and be safe from the evil consequences of honeyed words, and so he will not fall into the traps of the people of shirk which they set up to ensnare those who are easily deceived, follow their whims and desires and are weak.
Aug 10, 2014
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starstarstarstarstar 		ahem
by: Niseag

Allah is Great!

Repeating faulty sayings will not make them right. Just because one Freemason is going that faulty road, does not mean Freemasons in general do that.
You will find people like that in every society, yes you even find them in Saudi Arabia.

Allah keep you safe and open minded
Aug 10, 2014
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starstarstar 		Re: Muslim Freemason
by: Tim

Hello Peter,
and thank for contributing to the discussion.

As you have neglected to cite the source of your post, please allow me the liberty of doing so now. The post above appears to have been copied directly from the Islam Question and Answer website (http://islamqa.info/en/34576).

Unfortunately, there is no information on that site to indicate it's origin or author(s). It states that it is, "From Fataawa al-Lajnah al-Daa’imah, 2/312-315." However, I have been unable to locate any official or corroborating source for this statement.

What we do know is this: the post cites as one of it's sources the Protocols of the Elders of Zion. The Protocol is a known antisemitic hoax that was originally published in Russia around the turn of the 20th century. It was thoroughly exposed and debunked as a hoax in 1921. Unfortunately, there continues to this day those zealots and antisemites who insist that it is a real document.
Wikipedia

My questions to you, the reader, is how much credence should we give a post that uses a known hoax as one of its primary sources? How much credence can we give to the other sources in the post which are conveniently unavailable and most likely do not exist? And, how much credence shall we give to the author who bases his conclusions regarding Freemasonry on a known hoax?
Aug 13, 2014
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starstarstarstarstar 		4ever learning
by: Anonymous

Hello to all,

Tim, firstly I would like to thank you for your answers to my questions. As you have pointed out and my name suggests I am forever learning and after reading previous questions, I learnt the only way to get an answer with substance was to put some 'sting' into my posts, this seems to have worked.

Okay where were we, so freemasonry is here to help men become better men and the world a better place..... Great I'm all for that.
However, what I see as Haram (forbidden) from an islamic point of view is:

1. That simply being a Muslim, studying and following Islam, Hadith and spending time at the mosque is simply not enough to truly unleash our religious capabilities.... No no, the only true way to unleash our religious beliefs and be the best example of mankind is to be accepted as a Freemason.

2. Often the leaders of the Masonic lodges are referred to and have the title of: Worshipful

I have more, but am interested in your thoughts in relation to how a Muslim would perceive freemasonry as being haram (forbidden).

Thanking you in advance.
Aug 14, 2014
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starstarstarstarstar 		Worshipfull master
by: Ni Seag

The senior officer of a Masonic Lodge is the Master, normally addressed and referred to as the "Worshipful Master" (in Scotland, and in Lodges under the Scottish Constitution, the "Right Worshipful Master"). The Worshipful Master sits in the East of the lodge room, chairs all of the business of his lodge, and is vested with considerable powers without further reference to the members.The office of Worshipful Master is the highest honor to which a lodge may appoint any of its members. The office is filled annually by election, often by secret ballot. The requirements as to who is eligible for election as Master vary from jurisdiction to jurisdiction, but the majority of jurisdictions specify that a brother must have served as an installed Warden to qualify.

The honorific Worshipful does not suggest that the Master is worshiped, but is used in its original meaning, "worthy of respect". (Mayors and magistrates in parts of England are also traditionally called "Worshipful" or "Your Worship", as are certain bodies such as livery companies). French Masons use the word Vénérable as the honorific for their Masters.

At the conclusion of his limited term of office, a Worshipful Master is termed a Past Master.
Aug 14, 2014
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starstarstarstarstar 		beside
by: Ni Seag

beside my comment on the Title here is how I see my Muslim duties beside the 5 Pillars, I live my life as my belief and as such try to be an example, I will not wrong anyone and interact with all humanity. Enrichment in knowledge and walking the path helps and so far I have not found my membership as a Past Master in a Lodge any hindrance to my faith, sure I met those who will never believe, those who will never understand and those who do not want to believe or understand, I always found that a shame and test to my belief, only Allah may judge if I failed the test.
Aug 14, 2014
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starstarstarstarstar 		4ever learning
by: Anonymous

Hello to all,

Firstly Ni Seag,
Appreciate your answer and attempt at explaining what a Worshipful Master is. Truth is I did expect your answer somewhat in relation to the meaning of the title, as an 'old English' meaning does not directly relate to the modern language. Though what I did not expect and would not expect from an apparent Past Master was the blatant and direct copy and paste answer from Wikipedia.

Secondly
And this is the part that has me stumped, islamic Freemasons feel they need to join this secret brotherhood in order to attain fulfilment/enlightenment and the sense of belonging and achievement. As a convert to Islam, I do relate to this, however what I do not relate to, is seeking this outside of your religion. Instead of going to the mosque/Zikr/reading Quran, you replace this with attending the lodge with non Muslims however many times per month as this enables you to become a better man.
We are told that our prayers have more reward when performed inside a mosque, why then would you want to pray at the lodge instead of a mosque?

Thanking you in advance
Aug 14, 2014
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starstarstarstar 		More Masonic misinformation...
by: Tim

4Ever Learning,

How very shrewd of you, and as you say your tactic has generated the desired results. Bravo. Perhaps I'm the one being schooled here.

Okay, on to your questions:

"1. That simply being a Muslim, studying and following Islam, Hadith and spending time at the mosque is simply not enough to truly unleash our religious capabilities.... No no, the only true way to unleash our religious beliefs and be the best example of mankind is to be accepted as a Freemason."

Now you're just making this stuff up aren't you? Freemasonry has never made such a claim. As I have said repeatedly, Freemasonry has no purpose of goal regarding religion. It encourages its members to faithfully practice the religion of their own choosing. That's it. Nothing more. It doesn't even insist, urge or cajole. It merely encourages. How, and even if, we practice our religion is a personal decision and no concern of Freemasonry.

This claim would be ridiculous on its face. The Masonic fraternity is a social organization and Freemasonry its philosophical teachings. To claim that among all the philosophical schools of thought in all the world, and throughout the history of the world, only Freemasonry is capable of achieving personal enlightenment would be comparable to claiming that among the 7,500 varieties of apple grown in the world only the Granny Smith can provide nourishment.

"2. Often the leaders of the Masonic lodges are referred to and have the title of: Worshipful"

Regardless of whether Ni Seag said it first, his information is correct. The Master of the lodge is addressed as Worshipful only as an honorific. This is a tradition that has been carried forward from earlier days when such honorifics were more common. It is similar to addressing the chairperson or president of the body.

In point of fact, there are occasions, such as the conferral of degrees, when the person performing the duties of the Master has never officially served in that office. In those instances he is still addressed as Worshipful Master because it is the proper manner of addressing the acting leader of the lodge.
Aug 14, 2014
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starstarstarstarstar 		Freemasonry
by: Anonymous

You better no tell Hamas you are engaging in activities with the Freemasons. In their Charter they are bound to obliterate Freemasonry.

Article 17 of the Hamas Charter
The Moslem woman has a role no less important than that of the moslem man in the battle of liberation. She is the maker of men. Her role in guiding and educating the new generations is great. The enemies have realised the importance of her role. They consider that if they are able to direct and bring her up they way they wish, far from Islam, they would have won the battle. That is why you find them giving these attempts constant attention through information campaigns, films, and the school curriculum, using for that purpose their lackeys who are infiltrated through Zionist organizations under various names and shapes, such as Freemasons, Rotary Clubs, espionage groups and others, which are all nothing more than cells of subversion and saboteurs. These organizations have ample resources that enable them to play their role in societies for the purpose of achieving the Zionist targets and to deepen the concepts that would serve the enemy. These organizations operate in the absence of Islam and its estrangement among its people. The Islamic peoples should perform their role in confronting the conspiracies of these saboteurs. The day Islam is in control of guiding the affairs of life, these organizations, hostile to humanity and Islam, will be obliterated.
Aug 29, 2014
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starstarstarstarstar 		Muslim and a mason
by: Anonymous

Asalaam alykum,

I am a proud Muslim and mason. The way the media is spreading lies about Islam is no different than social media spreading lies about masonry. As long as I have been a mason, I found no contradictions between the two. I must say my brothers of Islam, please stop spreading rummors! It is quite easy to speak directly with a mason (we are in the phone book)- get the facts from us... if you are not sure about something, I suggesed one to do some research or refrain from spreading lies! If you are in a country where masonry is banned, you cannot join. Freemasonry is a fraternity of good men- nothing more, nothing less.

Your brother...
Sep 02, 2014
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starstarstarstar 		?
by: Anonymous

There seems to be a lot of conflicting comments regarding freemasonry and Islam. I don't have a specific view as such but I have a question.

1. Are U saying its basically a social network kind of thing that encourages people to practice their religion faithfully and become better people?

Also to all Muslims.. when we have such a strong Muslim brotherhood around us, why join the brotherhood of freemasons?

If U wanna become a better person do you really need to become a mason to do that? Join normal charity organisations, try and help more people around you..etc
If you want to become a better Muslim sit on your prayer mat, raise your hands and ask Allah to guide you and put imaan in your heart. Turn to Allah you don't need anyone to help you do this.
You only need Allah.
The whole idea of it may be with good intentions but I just don't see the purpose of it. And also, is it true you have rituals?
Sep 15, 2014
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starstarstarstarstar 		4ever learning
by: Anonymous

Hello to everyone,

Anonymous,
You raise very credible, non biased and informative questions in which you are only trying to discover for yourself as to why Muslims would and think they are bettering themselves to join freemasonry.
The answers above or lack there of should give you all the information you require.
We seem to get the same script of: Assalamu alaikum, I have been a freemason for X amount of years and it does not clash with Islam etc etc.
Though we get this script, unfortunately we are unable to entice truthful answers to our questions.
Another person posted above: I am a freemason and a Muslim....
Exactly, they call themselves Freemasons before anything.
What is the first thing you do when you greet someone? Shake there hand and say Assalamu alaikum. So when they shake their hands the freemason way, the first and foremost thing they are telling anybody is that they are a freemason.

Your questions above are some of the best I have seen asked, and I would like to see an islamic freemason answer them, not a non Muslim trying to give his point of view.

Stay safe, wa alaikum Salam.
Sep 21, 2014
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starstarstarstarstar 		Islam and Masons.
by: Bro. Allen

There seems to be Islamic hate preachers everywhere including here. Freemasonry unlike Islam encourages and teaches a man to think for himself and to love his fellow man. When I say love his fellow man that means the whole of mankind not just those that are Freemasons. Looking at what Islam has achieved recently I'd say it actively strives for the opposite.
Sep 21, 2014
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starstarstarstarstar 		What Freemasonry is...
by: Tim

Dear Anonymous and 4ever learning,

The reason you're not seeing timely responses to these questions is because we have answered these same questions, or versions thereof, over and over and time again. Freemasonry is a social organization with philosophical and moral teachings. It is not a network in the sense that its members are required or expected to promote or support each other for material or social gain. Freemasons often do conduct business together but only because we have all made the same promises to conduct ourselves with honor and honesty.

Freemasonry is not a religion but it does require a belief in the Supreme Being, and its members are encouraged, though not required or expected, to actively practice the religion of their own choosing.

No one needs to become a Mason. It is a choice. Those of us who make that choice continue as a member of the fraternity because we believe it adds something to our lives. Just what that something is most likely different for each Mason. For me, I enjoy the commaraderie, the social fellowship, the friends I have made, the philosophical teachings. I believe striving to live up to those philosophical teachings of brotherly love, relief, truth, honor, and dignity has made me a better man. Did I need Freemasonry to make me a better man? No. But, I enjoy Freemasonry.

Yes, we have Masonic rituals. They consist of dramatic portrayals of allegorical teachings designed to impress upon the mind and conscience those lessons of morality, love and charity for mankind, truth, and many others. There is nothing in our rituals, when understood, with which any good man would disagree.

4ever learning,

Welcome back. You just can't help but try and stir the pot can you? You assign priority where none is intended. You make assumptions without any genuine insight. And best of all, you request that questions be answered only by those of your own religion as if no one who is not of your relgion could have anything of value to contribute. This alone demonstrates a complete lack of understanding the principles of Freemasonry. Freemasonry teaches freedom of religion, and in that freedom is the belief that good men of all faiths can work together as brothers for the betterment of all. This page is open to the comments of all, and as long as those comments are respectful, civil and constructive all are welcome.

Respectfully,

Tim
Sep 22, 2014
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starstarstarstarstar 		My thoughts
by: Anonymous

Here are my thoughts:

With all respects to everyone who truly intends to be a good person and do true and good;

I think that a muslim might be able to get till the 32nd degree without trampling the values of our religion too much, but after that it will be finished. Lucifer is the devil. Muslims worship Allah and the devil is our enemy.

The reason freemasons want you to believe in God is because you have to have the sense to believe to be able to truly worship Satan. Someone who doesn't believe in God, doesn't believe in Satan either. I read Yasser Arafat was one, actually I think he is indeed a good example.
80% of Palestine dissapeared while he ruled Palestine with his PA. He didn't even try to save the Palestinians and was only following his Jewish masters. He was as silent as he could be while the Settlers grabbed the lands of the poor innocent people acre by acre. When he started to get old and too instable to ensure the continuety of the Jewish agenda, they got rid of him.
Freemasons have alot of power in the World, but they never fight for the lives or freedoms of genuine muslims, you go ahead and think why.

Look at Iraq, it's a product of masonry. And no this is not conspiracy, the US leaders are masons. Who would want to join a failed producer like that?

You want to be a better man? Join for example Islamic Relief. Find fun and relief in working and helping instead of gathering and secrecy.
May Allah guide you in your path.
Sep 22, 2014
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starstarstarstarstar 		hm
by: Ni Seag

Just the good old garbage and anti-masonic arguments, nothing new. Muslim and past master mason, and eyes I opened the can of being a Sufi as well (I know another can of worms for those taught in the Wahabi way). Been a Mason now for 30 years, never once was there anything done or said against me or my faith, never impeded in me practising my faith. Sure some will say a Sufi and Muslim does not go together, but so I walk my path and will be judged like everybody else when the day comes. Making a big statement about charities, memberships etc defeats the purpose, I'm not in this to create a public image or a status.

Enough said, this discussion does not get anyone anywhere
Sep 23, 2014
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starstarstarstarstar 		4ever learning
by: Anonymous

Hello to all,

Tim,

Hello again, great to converse with you once more.

Yes you are correct, I am unfamiliar with the teachings and principals of freemasonry. I am hoping you can clear things up for me.

Why don't we ever see the Freemason fraternity joining together to quash all of the fears and ridicule against Islam?

Why, if you stand for truth have you not demonstrated as a fraternity to end the ill treatment of Muslims.

As I would think that exposing the truth as you say you all stand for, would be protocol for the Freemasons.

How come we never see the Freemason fraternity informing the general public that the lies we are fed through the media are false?

Or is it only those inside the fraternity are available to the truth?

May Allah guide us and thank you in advance.

Sep 26, 2014
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starstarstarstarstar 		do the right thing
by: zartajdamuslimah

Best thing to do is go to the masjid and ask your iman dont believe what people tell you on this MashAllah
Sep 27, 2014
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starstarstarstarstar 		thank you tim
by: BD

Firstly I would like to thank Tim for his accurate representation of the fraternity.

Secondly 4ever learning, we are not a political organisation and therefore do not comment on any international event. We act without bias. We as an organisation do not comment against any anti-muslim acts around the world the same as we do not comment on say the current Ukraine Russia situation. We are not political.

Thirdly, we are not a religion. In fact in lodge there are 2 things that are banned. One is to have political discussions and the second is to have religious discussions. We are not there to differentiate between people of any walks of life. We are all equal when in the lodge and do not promote any anti anything!

Thirdly, if we are anti-muslim we are doing a bad job of it as freemasonry is quite popular in Turkey and some other places in the Muslim world. We encourage people from all walks of life to join white, black, Muslim, Christian. It doesn't matter. The biggest requirement is the belief in a supreme being, wether that is jesus, Allah, Buddha or not a god at all. A supreme being doesn't even have to be a 'god' it could just be a higher power. Agnostics can join just not atheists.

Just as people accuse the masons of anti-muslim thoughts you have to realise we have been accused of all sorts since we began. Catholics are still very much against us. Remember we are not a secret society but rather a society with secrets. It is for like minded people.

People are quick to blame what they don't understand for bad things. It's strange that a lot of Muslims are on here being so negative as freemasonry promotes treating your fellow man as your brother, isn't that the point of all religions too. Treat others as you wish to be treated.

To anyone looking to join, don't rush into it. Speak to a mason that you may know or contact your local lodge or grand lodge and speak to them about what it means to rhem to be a mason. You can then make your own mind up and be comfortable with your decision. But just remember this, the only regret I ever hear from my fellow mason is that they wish they had joint sooner.

Fraternally,

BD
Oct 27, 2014
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starstarstarstarstar 		Don't be a Freemason
by: Rima

No one gets it being a Freemason is like betraying your own religion so what if other Muslims are Freemasons doesn't mean you have to copy them people think being a mason is cool but it's not Freemasons hate Muslims and if you already are one and you wanna change back well you can't you started it and you will have to end it when you die in the day of judgement in your grave ALLAH will ask you questions and will say you betrayed your religion you betrayed everyone anyway Freemasons are stupid that's we you shouldn't be one please don't.
Oct 28, 2014
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starstarstarstarstar 		Rubbish
by: Anonymous

Rima; seems the part about learning in our Quran has been passing you without leaving a trace; inform yourself, think yourself and talk to Allah about it but don't come here with a dogmatic that does not allow you to discuss the issues. I will answer for my life because I live it walking the path, you answer for yours, what will you tell? Make a list and look at those actions you decided yourself ( not following other decision makers but those you make) and then compare what Freemasons do ( not what you think they do but what they really do) if you cann't find any good then you can argue not just into the empty space
Nov 01, 2014
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star 		general reminder for the muslim
by: Ali

Islam means peace aquired by submitting your will to god in every aspect of life.
A muslim is anyone who does that.
As Muslims our beloved prophet is a guide and example in every aspect of life and has showed us the way to salvation. We follow his way in all that we do. We should never ascribe to an organisation that is so secretive. We Muslims for maby reasons cannot join such a group. Many of the members are non muslims and we can never have loyalty with them over the believers. They also dont allow muslims to promote Islam and try to encourage others to have salvation in the gereafter. We are warned by our scholers that dajjal will appear towards the end of time. He will be given special abilities to bring the dead alive etc. Many people with weak faith will follow dajjal. those who has a strong faith will succseed.
Nov 02, 2014
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starstarstarstarstar 		To 4ever
by: Humble

I am the poster who said I was a Freemason and a Muslim. It does not matter what order I write it, I am always a Muslim first. It saddens me to see my brothers say such horrible things about Masonry. I claimed no religion when I joined (only believed in one God(swt)). In fact, if it wasn't for Masonry I wouldn't have found Islam. Alhamdulilah It helped me find faith in our creator.
My brothers!
Knowing how the public view Islam does not mean it's the truth.
Why attack Masonry the same way as the public attack us?
There is nothing secret about it. Can you trust your brother?

Secondly, when I shake hands with a Mason, it's no different than how I would shake anyone elses hand. Honestly, I greet my Muslim brother with a warm embrace!
If I found a conflict with these two groups, wallahi, I will choose my deen.

Your Brother.
Dec 03, 2014
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starstarstarstarstar 		Read and Abide
by: Anonymous

As I read all the comments thus far it saddens me.Even in the Qu'ran or The Holy Bible, it teaches that Allah/God is the creator of all things.Allah for instance wants you to study, and open your mind to knowledge for greater good.In both books it tells you not to judge, and have open arms to all brothers. Humanity forgets this rule and ignores all other aspects. My family has a historic line of freemasonry, so I know from first hand how each and everything works.Yes, it does seem like witch craft if you just look with closed eyes because of tradition and simple ignorance of the subject,but if you open them like Allah says then you will gain knowledge, which comes with understanding. The only one that is capable of judgement is Allah himself, not the man who praises him.
Dec 06, 2014
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starstarstarstarstar 		recommended author of books about muslims and freemasonry
by: Anonymous

Mustafa El-Amin, a Muslim Leader has written several books on this subject. The most popular one is, Freemasonry: Ancient Egypt and the Islamic Destiny. Very good read and information.
Dec 13, 2014
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starstarstarstarstar 		wait for few months
by: Anonymous

We will eradicate the army of satan, Freemasons, sooner than they suppose.
ان الارض یرثها عبادی الصالحون
Dec 13, 2014
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starstarstarstarstar 		Question for Tim.
by:

Hi Tim,

Firstly, i just want to say that i have come across this page very randomly as i rarely, in the past, researched about Freemasons. However, in saying that, recently i have become more and more curious/interested in the concept of Freemasonry, and have been doing some research.

Before i go on, i would like to state that i am a Muslim. (I can already see the hate coming), and that being a Muslim, my perception on my religion and life it's self is not controlled by narrow thinking. To every other Muslim commenting on here, please dont take this as an attack, i am merely just speaking for my self. I respect everyones beliefs and methods of practicing.

I grew up in a house with a very simple, yet powerful rule. "Be a good person, and do no harm to no one". To be honest, that is how i perceive my religion, if i was to sum it up.

The reason why im directing my question to you Tim is, going through this page, i have read your comments along with the others, and have observed the way you have been conducting yourself. I dont know who you are, and i already have respect for you. I admire your patience and detailed responses. So thank you in advance.

Now my question is, (sorry for the long intro), as a Freemason, are there any hidden agendas/ulterior motives behind the teachings that take place? Please excuse me my question if it seems too direct.

Also, is there, at any point, anything to fear with becoming a Freemason? For example, a secret that is shared with us whilst in the Freemason program, that will seem unusual and just simply not right. Or is all teachings purely based on positive things.

I base my questions purely on the basis of the 'Non stop stories' i have been hearing about Freemasons, (Being bad, not a good thing etc).

Others are welcome to respond too. More the merrier.

Thank you Tim.

Dec 13, 2014
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		Fair questions
by: Tharn

May I start off with a question of my own? You say, "I am a Muslim (I can already see the hate coming.)" Hatred from where? I hope you do not think that Freemasons would be hating you simply because of your faith. My own lodge has a number of Muslims, equal and respected. I am pleased and proud to know them and to have them as my friends.

As to your questions, ask away. You are certainly not offending by asking.

First, no, there is not a hidden agenda, certainly not one I have seen in close to 40 years as a Mason.

Our goal is openly stated - to help good men become better men. By the use of allegory and symbols, we try to support our individual efforts to behave in a moral and upright fashion. For example, the construction of Solomon's temple is used as an allegory to remind us of the requirement for courage, hard work, integrity and loyalty. The square reminds one so taught that a good man should treat every other man squarely - fairly, ie.

Second, there is nothing I have ever seen to fear in Freemasonry. No devil worship, no secret sins, no ulterior loyalties. The obligation we swear requires us to obey the laws both of God and of the nation we live in and to treat our fellow human beings with respect and justice. We do not specify who or what a member should consider the Deity to be, nor how that worship should be carried out; each man is expected to believe, to worship in his own way, according to his own religion.

To better explain that, Islam has certain requirements, eg the haj, and bars certain things such as the consumption of pork. Christianity has its own rules, its own ways to honour the Creator, as do Judaism, Bahai and every other faith. Yet all have certain things in common - the central commands concerning honesty, charity, reverence, etc. Masonry tries to ignore the differences and build on the commonalities. No good Mason would mock a fellow Mason for his faith, but rather would support him in his efforts, even if that faith is not the same as his own. For example, two of my lodge's Muslim members host a charitable dinner each year at Eid; it's a popular event, with Christian, Jew and Hindu honoured to be invited and pleased to be able to help good men in a good cause.

There is, in other words, absolutely no Masonic requirement for a member to stray from his faith, whatever that may be. Rather, we encourage each member in his own faith.

Good luck with your research. It can be a difficult journey as there is so much foolish, frightened and hate-filled nonsense around. We in Masonry look for the best in each man; those who criticize all too often look for the worst.
Dec 14, 2014
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		Fair Questions reply
by:

Thank you for that Tharn.

Just to clear something, when i said (I can feel the hate coming) i was directing that at the Muslims who might see me as a traitor for wanting to know about the Freemasons/Have an interest.

I had another question that i wanted to ask, im assuming you can hopefully answer this also.

Once again, based on stories that i have heard, is it true that during an initiation, you are put through several tests in which you possibly risk your health/life? In other words, does the initiation involve any violent and/or unusual activities?
Dec 14, 2014
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		Masonic tests....
by: Tim

Welcome to the discussion and thanks for visiting Masonsmart.

There is very little I could add to what Tharn has already said, and I certainly couldn't have said it any better. Thank you Brother.

In regards to your most recent question concerning violent or dangerous activity during initiation, no it is not true. The degrees of Freemasonry are designed to be solemn, meaningful, and to impress upon the candidate wise and important truths. While the legends of some degrees do contain tests of courage, bravery, self-sacrifice, perseverence and endurance these are allegorical as well and are lessons to be taken to heart, not to be experienced physically. At no time is the candidate intentionally placed in danger or at risk of injury. In fact, quite the opposite is true. While in darkness he is attended at every step to ensure his safety.

It sounds as if you and I grew up in very similary houses. "Be a good person and do no harm," is the credo I strive to live by every day. In my view, the teachings of Freemasonry are the Golden Rule (do unto others as you would have them do unto you) with sprinkles on top. There is nothing particularly new in its teachings. Rather, it takes the most ancient truths of mankind and presents them in ways that make indelible impressions upon the heart of the willing candidate.

Thank you for your interest and your questions. Keep them coming should others occur to you and we'll answer them as best we can.

Fraternally yours,

Tim
Dec 14, 2014
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		Keep those questions coming
by: Tharn

Thank you, Bro Tim.

If I might amplify just a little...

There are symbolic hazards during an initiation, but note the emphasis on symbolic. As Tim has stated, at no time is there any physical danger or stress. It's rather like those legendary 'blood oaths' the foolish would have you believe in. The obligation traditionally does include some pretty nasty penalties (although some jurisdictions have removed them altogether) but they are entirely symbolic, intended to emphasize how a Mason should feel if ever tempted to break his word. They date back to our forebearers in the Middle Ages, when such horrific things were sadly common.

Moreover, the ceremony is one which literally millions of honest, decent and God-fearing men have gone through without problem or shame. There is nothing demeaning, belittling or nasty about it. No man need fear anything there, especially we would say, when supported by his faith.
Dec 26, 2014
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		MASONIC FAMILY
by: Anonymous

im a Muslim women and Im part of the order of the eastern star, which is part of the masonic family, and I see nothing wrong with it, they never discuss politics or different religions as long as you believe in a supreme being which could be god or Allah that's all it matters, it teaches you about giving to the less fortunate and to be a better person over all the discipline to be honest since I joined I have become a better Muslim and more religious.
Im glad what Iam and I know the feeling when people find out Im part of the masonic family the first thing people say is Im a Jew and that my
" people" are out there to destroy Muslims, its a bunch of crap none of the teachings say that or even mention anything about that.
So people need to stop judging a person without knowing exactly what its all about.


Dec 27, 2014
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starstarstarstarstar 		you obviously don't know!!!
by: Anonymous

Hello well first of all, selamunaleykum brothers and sisters, masonic beliefs is not even close to islamic belief, first of all you CANNOT have a female freemason, but you might have a member of the branches so called, lions club, rotary club...etc freemasonry is worshipping devil. If you are ready to sell your soul thats when you are one, but dont forget we dont own our body our soul so how dare you surrender something that you dont own? The punishment of hell fire is beneath the lowest level,
freemasonry is a.k.a ILLUMINATI the all seeing eye occult secret organization, they are zionist they are the ones who cause these wars, the isis, pkk, kkk, all run by the zionist freemasons , looks into the bilderberg group, the missing malaysian plane.
OPEN YOUR EYES. They are killing the innoncent, and blame it on the muslims. Infact 911, how many times they were proven that it was a setup BUT as you would all know they own the media they do a cover up job by blinding us, WAKE UP.

Look at the HOLLYWOOD star all have money all have nice cars, but the illuminati owns them if they dont participate with there rules they get blamed as being a pedophile of a rapist or die mysteriously, e.g princess diana, micheal jackson, elvis presley, 2pac shakur, famous and rich self made billionaires by selling there soul...... so make your choice bloke!!! U cant be a muslim and a freemason you can only be ONE! Worship allah or worship the devil. And last thing yes freemasonry is a religion. They practice satanizm
Dec 27, 2014
Rating
starstarstar 		Poor fellow
by: Lant

"U cant be a muslim and a freemason you can only be ONE!"

Wow.

Is that anything like saying that you can't be a Muslim and ride a bicycle at the same time, that it's one or the other? That you can't be a Christian and a pediatrician at the same time, that it's one or the other?

Sadly, somebody has been feeding you a load of hate-filled hogwash. And it *is* sad, because love is the answer, not hate.

Having been a Mason for 30+ years, I speak from personal knowledge and experience when I say there is no devil-worship in Freemasonry. None. You one the other hand are not a Mason and *cannot* know; your statements are based on malevolent gossip, nothing more.

The world is not run by mysterious conspiracies, friend. There are entire shelves of books on the psychology of the conspiracy theorist; it's a sad little world when you have to blame everything on Them...

Open your eyes and stop letting others fill you with hate.
Jan 22, 2015
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starstarstarstarstar 		Clarifying doubts
by: Anonymous

No, there is no problem from the point of wiew of free masonry
A lot of muslims are members of Turkish Lodge; in Israel there is a lodge whose members are muslims , jews and christians and some gnostics, agnostics and atheists of course.
You could read my mother Lodge; apoem writen by Rudyard Kipling

In some Lodges you have to believe in god or in a kind of Universal principle of creation etc Deist.
Some masonic order or orients are Trinitarians. I think that you will be in troubles with Muslims being a free masons. Some Imans have declared fatwa against free masons and sufis.
Then do not be afraid ; Masonry is a door open to the Universe and It is a beautiful path to travel.
After a short time you will not know if you are muslim, christian , jew buddhist, atheist ,gnostic, agnostic anarchist, pagan you will be a free mason; plainly a better man.
Jan 22, 2015
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starstar 		I disagree
by: Tharn

Very sorry, but you are mistaken.

1. It's not 'some' that require such belief. Belief in a supreme beng is a fundamental principle of all regular Freemasonry. There are some places which do not require that, but they are not recognized by mainstream Masonry. They are irregular, not considered 'real' Masons.

2. If by "Trinitarian", you mean Christian, there again you are in error. Freemasonry does not insist on Christianity, nor does the Christian Trinity appear in any Masonic work I have ever seen. Indeed, all men who believe in a supreme being are welcome, be they Christian, Jewish, Muslim or whatever - all are equal under the Almighty.

3. Lastly, I cannot imagine a Mason forgetting whether he is Muslim or Christian or whatever his faith may be. Masonry is not - not - a religion, nor does it replace religion, nor does it lead men to forget their own faiths. Indeed, Freemasonry strongly encourages its members to actively participate in their own religion.

So, while I agree that Masonry is a good opportunity for a man of any religion to improve himself, I think you have seriously misunderstood its nature.
Feb 09, 2015
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		the right is clear from the subterfuge
by: Anonymous

Hello every body,
May you all be guided by the light and find inside you your wisdom that will make you build a better future.
I am a muslim, not a free masson, I am very satisfied about my faith and my ability to connect with the divine and experience the bounty and mistery of the universe. I find many of your so called values expressed here already sahared with me and many of your attractive discours, already thought about it without being in any fraternity.
I think freedom need you to be first free from other beings and their abstractions especially your fellow beings as their world in your dimension. And in this way, being part of this fraternity is another trap that will force to have oath for other humans. thats good in the sens if it makes you better in the service of goodness and light but it is better if you learn it by yourself and decide by yourself without any sponsoring to define what you gonna be and how you gonna serve humanity and connect with god. As a muslim i dont find any necessity to join any human org that will jail me again. However we do have freewill and everybody has the right to conceal his fears, to find answers to his questions and seek to find himself in the way he choose.
I ve heard from many sources bad things about the fraternity mostly from Christian sources, am I doubtful about them?
Well, I need to read the massons sources to decide by myself about the subject, however I have some questions :
There are many US politicians in USA who are Massons, I might say USA is full of them, however, I want to know wht is the light of these politicians and the outcome of their wisdom?
Is it the support/complicity of the crimes of Israel killing thousands of children?
or the support of many dictators in africa and the Arab world?
Or the war on Iraq, syria and afghanistan ?
or and or how much do have innocent people pay for your light? by bringing them more darkness or choosing in their place what you decided for them?
Thanks to answer me with wisdom, life and compassion
Feb 09, 2015
Rating
starstarstar 		Good men, bad men
by: Lant

Well, thank you for your questions.

First, it is good that you are satisfied with your faith; it is perhaps the greatest thing possible for a man to connect with God.

We do not say that any man, let alone every man, has to become a Mason - and it would be foolish for a man to join if there was any possibility of it distancing him from the Almighty. Freemasonry is but one way to study morality and it truly does not conflict with any other. To be a good man, one who lives in awe of and obedience to God, who strives to treat his fellow men with compassion, generosity and fairness, who surrounds himself with men with those same goals - how can this contradict the teachings of any religion?

I would suggest that any group that tries to get good men of all religions, nations and races to sit together in peace and harmony cannot be all bad.

As to politicians being Masons, some are good, some are not - just as the same as politicians around the world who are not Masons. To be fair, I think you will admit the same of Islam. I have Muslim friends who are indeed good people, but there are sadly bad men there, too, men who do not live up to the Prophet's teachings, who fail to follow any law but their own. In each case, it is because every group on this world is comprised of men, and no matter how divine the vision, no matter how earnest the effort, all men are fallible.

As to some Christians' feelings about Freemasonry, they are entitled to their opinions, but the belief is hardly universal within Christianity. Even within Islam, there are deep divisions. Should one judge by those divisions and disagreements or by success at the things all good men believe in - charity, kindness, integrity, etc?

With respect to the many conflicts in the Middle East, there is enough evil to go around and Freemasonry as a group has absolutely no opinion on such matters. While each Mason is free to have his own opinion, discussion of such political questions is absolutely banned within our lodges. We simply do not get involved with such things. Sorry.

God be with you, my friend. May He continue to lead you in the paths of goodness and enlightenment. Thank you again for your questions.
Feb 10, 2015
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		answer
by: Anonymous

I thank you also for your time to answer my questions.
I think to be able in some situation to connect with the divine, feel it inside you and with you, being able to interpret his signs and his language to you upon your experience is natural, the universe is full of sockets that enable its beings to build their harmony with god and with the universe itself, it is up to you and there are even who are by default and by definition connected. I believe it is the purpose of life, it is also challenging to maintain and to develop it.

We got religion from men, whatever it is Islam, christianity, budhism , huindhuism, judaism , etc. As far as we dont strive to emancipate our minds from the abstractions that men gave us about the faith in order to come alone with our faith to connect with the divine and construct a faith that make light from our hands, we could never understand the purpose, neither bring and practice its light. It depends on each individual to build his own particular relation with the creator and trigger his connectors towards god like a tree. I also think, that morals evolves in time and are a question of cultures, traditions, practice, knowledge, experience and context. They are not rigid but agile and very adaptable. However, I dont deny that there are universal values and ethics that are beyond time and space like kindness, justice, patience and wisdom.

Of course, all men are fallible and Islam as any other belief system is not an exception, but let me also add, that in this case, on which understanding of Islam we are talking? a god that reveal his message and make freewill among many of the tenet laws when getting to know his words, you want to find the truth, you need to struggle, to reason, to struggle more, to think and rethink , to choose, to change, to experience, to go and come back and to live it. A journey also, may be a trap and a filter where only the most devoted light can go to the deepness of the quran. No sponsor nor any guide will never make you able to find the way, because the book speaks to each one differently with the different canals and inside it are infinite layers of wisdom and abstractions.

I think we have to judge to progress and change (judging is the base to make ethics and morals), we have to judge to see the mirror of our actions and make better the future, we need it, if we dont do judge we will never be able to see ourselves, nor question our lives, existence, behaviours, intentions and what we choose to be and we have defined for ourselves and all the others. it is important to always judge with justice itselves and the behaviour of others to learn and change. Now, if any judgement lead from prejudice, insecurity and hatred, I think the problem is in the person itself and he only used his judgement to streignten those feelings and secure them.
As muslims, we need absolutely to judge ourselves and judge the actions and the motivations of our people and others to progress, leran, and adopt also beter ways of ethics. I see things this way.
i also dont believe and totally against races, I may accept slightly the concept of nations when it doesnt exceed the cultural level in the good way but I will always fight the notion of races. Humans are equal, they are not races, neither are superior on each other. their social, cultural and ideological divisions are only the product of context, resources and their experiences.

God is with everybody, we are in his creation, bounded by his laws, wisdom and justice. His light is eternal and everywhere, it up to us to be able to see it and live it.
Whatever we do, whatever we make, we will all come back at the end to the source and get justice, kindness and wisdom.

Everybody is free to find his path and join anything he find himself comfortable with.

Regards,
Feb 11, 2015
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		Moved
by: Lant

I must sincerely say that I am deeply impressed. Would that this poor planet had more men such as yourself. I will be passing your word to others.

A couple of points for clarification.

WRT 'race', I agree with you. We are all God's creations. I mention it only as it seems to matter to some. My lodge has men of all colours and from well over a dozen nations. That there are ways to bridge the differences, to see that what we have in common is far more important than those minor differences - that is the thing.

Which understanding of Islam (ditto Christianity, Judaism, etc) are we talking about? To my mind, the one understood by each individual man. As Voltaire noted, all sects are different, because they come from men; morality is everywhere the same, because it comes from God. (I think that might actually be better explained by noting that all religions and their beliefs are constructed by men. The Almighty may present His wishes, but what follows thereafter is in the weak hands of man.) No system, no religion, no philosophy can ever make *all* men good, because they *are* men, thus inherently fallible, inherently limited.

I agree with you that it is up to each person to find their own way to God. How can it be otherwise? To compel a man to 'believe' only thus and so, that does not bring real belief. It only brings outward conformity, leaving the soul still without ease or certainty. Yet, given a place to start and good guidance, each man has the potential to achieve what his Creator intended. That, perhaps, is the value of external tutors, guides, preachers and such; they can give a seeker different ways to consider the wisdom in front of him, to make it easier to find his path.

(For what it is worth, each man is expected to find different wisdom in Freemasonry. The system is complex enough that no two men will ever interpret everything in it precisely the same, yet all are drawn towards the same goal - to become better men, ones benevolent and charitable towards his fellow creatures and upright in the service of the Almighty. We merely present a system and it is up to the individual to seek wisdom from it. The effects are subtle and some are content just to find just social interaction with like-minded men. Others can find the insight profound, reinforcing existing beliefs and leading to definite improvement.)

I have, by the way, visited a number of mosques and have been moved by the sense of serenity I have seen there. God's peace is a wonderful thing.
Feb 12, 2015
Rating
starstarstarstar 		Judgement
by: Tim

I find this latest exchange to be very interesting, and while I naturally agree with most of what has been said I am curious about the comments regarding judgement. I do believe we should always monitor and judge our own intentions, motivations and actions. Only by doing so can we hope to circumscribe our baser instincts and desires, and create the better version of ourselves that we want to be.

Perhaps I am misunderstanding your meaning, but I wonder if in assuming the right to judge others are you equally comfortable with being judged by others? And, should we also assume the right to pass judgement on others or only to judge them in comparison to our own actions for the purpose of self improvement?

I ask because of the differences in cultures. I wholeheartedly agree that we are all equal and no race or society is superior to another. But while our differences may be the result of context, resources and experience they are nonetheless real. Different societies view behaviors differently. A behavior that is perfectly acceptable in one society may be considered quite strange to another. Without proper context and understanding how can we righteously judge others?

I realize that judgement is a necessity in a society to maintain peace and civility, but surely our judgement of one another must be tempered with tolerance. Two people may behave in the same manner but for completely different reasons and with completely different motivations. While one may act to serve himself, the other may act in mercy to another. Without an ability to look into a man's heart and know why he did what he did we can not assume a right to judge him. Only the Almighty has that ability and only he has the right to pass judgement. This is what I believe.
Feb 15, 2015
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		Why I embraced Islam
by: Bob

Dear friends,

I became a muslim thanks to what I learned in Freemasonry.
Freemasonry (FM) lead me to Islam !
Since I embraced Islam, my life as a mason was enhanced manifold.

It is sad to read comments of some muslims who are stuck within their own prejudices.

God All Mighty commends us to read, use our reason and open our hearts and minds to other communities.

All the so-called secrets in FM are to be found in the thousands of books for sale at any book store.

May peace be upon you all my dear brothers and sisters in humanity.

Bob
Feb 19, 2015
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		4ever learning
by: Anonymous

Assslamu alaikum and hello to all,

To the masons out there can you please explain this:

A Muslims understanding of prophet Jesus (pbuh) is that before he was crucified, Allah raised him into heaven and replaced him with another person on the cross before he was crucified. We believe that he did not die on earth.

Is there anything about freemasonry rituals and teachings regarding Jesus's (pbuh) crucifixion/death that may contradict what Allah has told Muslims in the quran?

Thanking you in advance.
Feb 20, 2015
Rating
starstarstar 		Nope
by: Lant

Fair question.

The entry point for all Masons is what is popularly called 'the Blue Lodge'. With a very few exceptions, there is no reference to the New Testament or to Jesus in the Blue Lodge. One exception is, I believe, in Sweden, where Christianity is required. Otherwise, there is no requirement to adhere to any particular faith.

Portions of the Old Testament are used there as the basis for teaching allegories. As an example, the building of the Temple in Jerusalem by King Solomon is used as an allegory of the challenges any man will face as he goes through life. That doesn't mean a Mason has to believe in the historical truth of the stories, but they are useful training aids.

Now, beyond the three degrees in the Blue Lodge there are dozens upon dozens of other Masonic groups. A few of these require do Christianity of their members, but a decision to go beyond Blue Lodge Masonry and join these is always voluntary and many Masons, including Christian Masons, never go that way. They're like clubs in a high school. Everybody is there to learn and that's the Blue Lodge. Some decide they want to join the chess club or the debating society. That's fine, but they're not the core of the school and no student has to belong to them.

In short, there is no conflict I know of between Masonry and Islam. My Lodge has a number of Muslims and they are quite comfortable with it.

Thaks for asking.
Feb 20, 2015
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		4ever learning
by: Anonymous

Assslamu alaikum and hello to all,

Lant thank you for your answers.

So the blue lodge is for the first number of degrees of masonry and in this is teachings regarding prophet Suleyman?

So even though freemasonry is not a religion, it requires belief in, and it's foundations of teachings are based on the prophets of god?

Is there a connection between Masonic teachings and the belief and teachings of the ways of life on the Knights Templar?
Feb 21, 2015
Rating
starstarstarstar 		Hello
by: Lant

All Masons take the first three degrees. Many (most?) never go any further. A group of Masons meeting together in those three degrees is colloquially referred to as a 'Blue' Lodge or a 'Craft' lodge. There are other groups which Masons can join if they wish, but Masonry is centred about those first three degrees and it is about those I speak.

With respect to Solomon, what we know about the man is in reality very limited and comes from religious books - Torah, Bible and Koran. We know far more about, say, Saladin, than Solomon.

Freemasons have however taken those bare facts about a wise, devoted and powerful man and used them to fabricate a piece of historical fiction which we use to teach moral lessons. Solomon's actual teachings are not featured in our lessons and I doubt any Masons seriously believe that this useful tale is anything more than a parable.

Regular Freemasonry requires a prospective member to believe in the existance of a God. That's all we ask. We do not expect a propsective member to name his religion, nor do we follow the teachings of any religion in particular, for we are not a religion nor a substitue for religion.

Each religion has certain beliefs. You, who appear to be Muslim, are supposed to complete a pilgrimage, abstain from certain foods and so forth. Christians have their own different set of beliefs, as do Jews, Jains, Hindus, etc. Yet they all share a common set of basic beliefs and rules - honour and obey God, treat your fellow men fairly, behave honourably, practise charity etc. Freemasonry, while respecting all faiths, overlooks the differences between them and concentrates on the things all religions have in common.

As to the Knights Templar, there is no connection between them and Masonry. The order was exterminated in 1307 CE and I doubt that any of whatever they taught is known to anybody.

It is true that a number of Masons started a group named after the Knights Templar, but that was comparatively recently, hundred of years after the Knights Templars were killed. There is no linkage beyond name. It is also true that one of the many theories about Freemasonry is that some Knights Templar escaped to Scotland, hid out for hundreds of years and eventually founded the Freemasons, but the theory is based on a lot of things for which there is not much evidence. It's most unlikely in my opinion.

Peace be unto you, my friend.
Mar 07, 2015
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starstarstarstarstar 		Muslim Freemasons: A surprising history
by: Irfan

A number of prominent Muslims were, at one time, Freemasons. This includes:

Shaykh Quilliam, founder of the first mosque in Britain.

Abdelkader El Djezairi, leader of the Algerian resistance against the French.

Sayyid Jamal ad-Din al-Afghani, founder of anti-colonial politics in the Middle East.

Muhammad Abduh, Grand Mufti and theologian.

For more info you can check out:
www.islam-freemasonry.com
Mar 08, 2015
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		4ever learning
by: Anonymous

Assalamu alaikum and hello to all.
Thank you Lant for your clarifications. You have clearly taken some time to go into detail.
Lant as you have clearly explained you are indicating your knowledge on the first three degrees.
As we are all aware that freemasonry goes well higher, some even confirming higher than 33 degrees, can someone in the higher degrees please answer my question:
As God has told us in The Quran that Jesus pbuh did not die on earth, Jesus pbuh was raised to heaven prior to crucifixion. Is there anything one must understand and believe in freemasonry rituals about the apparent crucifixion of Jesus pbuh that collides with what we are told in The Quran?

Thanking you in advance.
Mar 12, 2015
Rating
starstarstarstar 		Freemasonry's goal is peace & harmony
by: Tim

Greetings 4ever learning,

Welcome back and thank you for your questions.

The answer is no, there is nothing in Freemasonry that requires a man to accept or believe anything contrary to his religious faith. Freemasonry uses parables based in history to teach morality, nobility and chivalry. Further, should a man ever discover anything in Masonry which he could not conscientiously permit or abide by he is free to sever his relationship and association with the Order at any time.

Thank you again and may peace by upon you.

Fraternally,

Tim
Mar 12, 2015
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		4ever learning
by: Anonymous

Assalamu alaikum and hello to all.

Tim great to converse with you once more.

Tim I have reason to believe otherwise, though I will take your answer into consideration, because at the end of the day unless I myself delve into freemasonry I truly would not know.

At any stage in ones Masonic journey to ascend, is there any rituals or degrees that may require the adornment of a cross on any clothing/ornaments that is worn? Being it a piece of clothing, a hat, ring etc?

Thanking you in advance.
Mar 12, 2015
Rating
starstarstar 		That much I can answer
by: Lant

Is there any part of Freemasonry which involves a cross? The simple answer is, Yes, certainly. One branch of what is referred to as the York Rite is called The Knights Templar. (Although it styles itself by that name, there is no historical connection with the long-exterminated monastic order.) In any case, this body is openly and emphatically Christian in nature.

Now, should this comcern a devout Muslim? I would say not. There are Boy Scout groups which insist on its members being Christian, but that does not in any way mean that the world-wide body of Scouting does or that a Muslim boy would risk his faith by joining another, less-denominational scout group. As another analogy, your local shopping district has a hundred independent stores; one of them is a wine store. Would you refuse to shop in any of the other 99 because of it?

There are dozens of branches of Freemasonry. One is Christian. Entry into that latter body is of course completely voluntary, meaning that under no circumstances would a Muslim be forced to join or associate with it, much less espouse its doctrines.

Freemasonry is so broad that I would be shocked if one man belonged to all branches. There's no possible way for one man to have viewed it all, but everything in Masonry is voluntary and there is never compulsion. It is expected that any member feeling that what he is asked to do conflicts with his faith, his family or his duties to his neighbours or his state will simply resign, go his own way without hard feelings.

You seem to have a couple of misapprehensions; permit me to put your mind at rest.

First, concerning the number of Masonic 'degrees'. You say, "... some even confirming higher than 33 degrees." OK, that's error number one. Freemasonry has no patent or copyright on our names and symbols. Anybody can bill themselves as a Mason. You could yourself announce in tomorrow that you personally are a 97th Degree Mason. Would that make you one? Hardly. People making claims of 'higher' degrees, ones beyond 33 are, um... not being quite honest. There just aren't any such levels. It's a very convenient fiction for those seeking to enlarge their already-inflated ego, to make money or to fool the credulous, but it's nothing more than a fiction - a lie. Nobody has 'confirmed' that - the most that one can say is that somebody lied.

As to the question as to whether or not Jesus died on the Cross, outside of that very limited subsection of Masonry, that's a religious question which would never come up, simply *because* it is a religious question. One of our strictest rules is that the Craft does not permit religious or political discussions within the lodge, for precisely this reason - Freemasonry is not a religion, has no religious doctrine and will not engage in religious or political debate as such things have the potenotial to cause strife amongst our members. We do not expect our individual members to accept or believe each other's faith or beliefs; we do expect that each will observe his own faith and respect that of others, just as they are expected to respect yours.

You say you,"have reason to believe otherwise." OK, we seem to be having an open, frank and mutually respectful discussion, so let's be open about such claims. What specific reasons do you have to doubt what Tim has said?
Mar 12, 2015
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		4ever learning
by: Anonymous

Assalamu alaikum and hello to all.

First of all I would just like to express that I do not prefer to engage in dialogue over the internet, I would much prefer to discuss this in person. However since this is not possible, I will continue on.

Lant I will not be explaining from with where I gather my information, though I appreciate your explanations.

I appreciate your substantial answer however my last query remains unanswered:

At any stage in ones Masonic journey to ascend, is there any rituals or degrees that may require the adornment of a cross on any clothing/ornaments that is worn? Being it a piece of clothing, a hat, ring etc?

Thanking you in advance.


Mar 12, 2015
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		Whence come you?
by: Tim

What exactly is your concern with a cross? Is it because Buddha is said to have died on a cross? Is it because the Druids cut an oak into the shape of a cross, built their temples in that form, and held it sacred? Could it be because Krishna is said to have died pierced with arrows upon a cruciform tree? Is it the Tao cross of ancient Egypt that gives you concern? Or, might it be that the posts set up along the Nile indicating by their transverse beams the height to which the waters might be expected to rise, and so became emblems of good fortune, safety and plenty? Is this what concerns you about the cross?

The cross is not necessarily a Christian symbol. It is far older than Christianity and has been a sacred symbol from the earliest of time. Yes, the cross is used as a symbol in Freemasonry as is the crescent, the scimitar, the eagle, a full moon, the sun, hand tools, a human skull, a skeleton, the eye, the letter G, a keystone, a sword, a heart, and all number of other things.

Is the wearing of a cross required in the ascension of the Masonic journey? No. There is no ascension beyond the 3rd degree, that of Master Mason. All other bodies and degrees are entirely optional and/or by invitation.

Your continued attempts at establishing a connection between Freemasonry and religion is becoming tiresome. It is patently obvious that your intent here is not to learn about or gain an understanding of Freemasonry, but instead to uncover some imagined conflict or to create the perception of a conflict between Masonry and the religion of Islam. The teachings of Freemasonry do not conflict with any established religion. This includes the religion of Islam as has been stated clearly on this very page by several of your Muslim brethren who actually do have knowledge and understanding of Freemasonry. If you choose not to believe me, so be it, but I would think that your fellow Muslim brothers have earned the benefit of the doubt. They at least know from whence they came.

Fraternally yours,
Mar 13, 2015
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		4ever learning
by: Anonymous

Assalamu alaikum and hello to all.

Good day to you Tim, appreciate you taking the time to come back to this forum time after time. It looks as if you have been returning here going on 4 years.

Okay so one does wear many symbols, one of those being a cross.

Though ones interpretation of that cross from outside the Masonic fraternity may be different to that of one inside the fraternity.

I'm going to go back to basics here, to a point that bares all relevance.

There are 2 Muslim men, sitting inside a Masjid, one being a Freemason and the other one not. The Muslim who is Masonic can ask his brother all questions about his path, Islam, all ins and outs, history, prophet Mohammed pbuh, and he will oblige to tell him, actually enjoy sharing his path and his knowledge on life and Islam.
Now the non mason returns the questions. The mason will answer all questions as one should. Now the non mason starts asking questions about freemasonry.... Now the mason can only go so far as he has sworn an oath, one in which he was blindfolded and made to feel the presence of a sword or other life threatening object that he will always keep the secrets of freemasonry inside the fraternity only.
This is my point, inside a Masjid, inside a house of God the mason will not tell his Muslim brother everything about freemasonry or what happens inside a lodge, that remains a secret. He has taken an oath greater than that of Allah and his Muslim family.

My friends in humanity, I don't believe there is a bigger oath than the one you have with God,your family, your brothers and sisters in this world.

That simple fact alone is why I believe that freemasonry drives a wedge between those that are masons and those that aren't. As the Masonic secrets can only he shared to other masons inside a lodge. Point and case.

Now Tim I want to make this clear to yourself and everyone else here that I do not wish to insult anyone or to be seen as attacking anyone. I only wish to be brutally honest and give my exact intentions of my thoughts.
If you do not wish to reply that is fine, though I have given you my exact thoughts and feelings on this matter as a point in truth, not in insult.

Thanking you in advance.
Mar 13, 2015
Rating
starstarstar 		Not exceptional
by: Lant

Ahh, I think we are getting closer to the real issue. Correct me if I am wrong, but this would seem to be the concern of a perceived conflict of loyalties. That's a fair question, one to which I can see no Mason objecting to or feeling insulted by. Such things are always easier to deal with out in the open.

In every country, every society - including strongly Muslim places such as Saudi Arabia and Iran - there are many groups, organizations and individuals required by law, custom or internal agreement to keep secrets.

Anyone in the armed forces of a nation can expect to have to take an oath of loyalty to the nation; moreover, such individuals will in most countries have to sign an oath of secrecy. They will not of course know at the what secrets they are swearing to keep, just that any secrets given them are to be guarded. They are, as it were, swearing that oath blindfolded.

Lawyers and doctors are required to respect client confidentiality - secrecy, ie. Not sure how it works in your faith, but a Christian priest is also bound to keep certain things secret and can get in a lot of trouble if they are revealed.

Employees of many firms and members of boards of directors are given confidential information. If they reveal such secrets, they can expect to be severely censured - disciplined, dismissed, maybe sued for damages. Members of professional sports teams have confidential playbooks. Newspaper reporters have confidential sources. In a marriage, husband and wife have secrets between them, ones which each partner expects the other to respect.

Have all these people, "taken an oath greater than that of Allah and his Muslim family?" Does the fact that the manager of a store or a policeman or a lawyer is expected to keep some things secret 'drive a wedge' between he and his friends? Of course not.

Our ordinary world is filled with areas with secrets, ones I feel sure that even the most devout Muslim would not complain about. I doubt that he would feel compelled to share them in a mosque or consider that such things are a higher oath or greater priority than his love of the Almighty.

Why is that? Well, put simply, I think that he would know that there is no conflict between his religion and those other confidences he has been given.

Freemasonry is in other words hardly exceptional in demanding that its members keep some things to themselves. Moreover, we are specifically and explicitly told that such obligations do not cover crimes or improper behaviour of any sort.

As to symbols, you are precisely correct - a symbol means what the viewer wants it to mean. Consider an equilateral triangle, for instance. A triangle was a very early Christian symbol, one representing the Trinity. But a triangle was also the very first trademark registered in the UK and that had nothing to do with any religion. A triangle can represent masculine or feminine, depending on which way it is pointing. To a physicist or mathematician, a triangle is the letter Delta and represents change. To some schools of philosophy, it represents harmony, to others stability. To an alchemist, a triangle represented fire or water, depending on its orientation. To a cartographer, it's a symbol for a mountain or a datum point.

So - I show you a triangle. What is its meaning? Obviously, its meaning lies in the context. To insist that a cross automatically equates to Christianity is like insisting that the crescent is always a symbol of Islam. Yes, it is that, but it can also represent the moon (and yes, I am aware of the linkage) or silver, edible food, etc.

I say it again - no man would ever be asked in Masonry to violate any religious or ethical standard. No Mason would ever be forced into something he finds objectionable.
Mar 13, 2015
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		Two men...
by: Tim

Peace be upon you and upon us all.

And, a good day to you, 4ever learning. I trust you understand that as Masons we are frequently and roundly attacked by those who base their accusations on misinformation and ridiculous conspiracy theories. Because of the sensational nature of the propaganda against Masonry the simple truths we try to tell are often dismissed as only more secret keeping. As you say, I have been addressing these issues for a long time. Perhaps I have become overly sensitive and may at times perceive attack where there is none. I pray that's not the case, but I feel some self-assessment may be in order. In any case, I hope my words or tone did not offend. My intent was not to do so but to be, as you say, brutally honest.

I appreciate your analogy of the two Muslim men, one a Mason, sitting inside a Masjid. It is considered and well put. The fault with the analogy, to my mind, is that it, again, conflates Freemasonry with religion. Freemasonry is not a religion, conflicts with no religion, is not a substitute for religion, has no religious dogma, offers no path to salvation.

The two men may each very well enjoy sharing their path with the other, but both men will keep to themselves that which they should. As Lant so correctly points out, there are secrets to be kept. But, neither man keeps any secret from God. Only He, ultimately, accompanies us on our path and only He is the ultimate judge.

No man is entitled to know the secrets of another, no matter how innocent the asking or the telling. One man may wonder how to trust a man who keeps secrets, while the other how to trust a man who can not.

Fraternally and respectfully,

Tim
Mar 23, 2015
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		4ever learning
by: Anonymous

Assalamu alaikum and hello to all.

Tim appreciate your answers and you point out a valid way of looking at ones ability to keep secrets.

A question that has been boiling for a while is:

If one is in a court of law and they are requested by the ruler of the court to explain the secrets/rituals/teachings and ins and outs of freemasonry, what is the outcome?

Do they hold on to the secrets and not oblige to the requests of the court?

Thanking you in advance.
Mar 23, 2015
Rating
starstar 		Personal integrity
by: Tharn

This is always a good ethical question. A similar one is that a) Masons are expected to obey the laws of the place they live in and b) Masons are expected to be moral men, so what happens when a) and b) conflict, when a Mason is faced with a highly immoral law?

Right off the bat, I cannot think of a case where that would happen, but OK. I believe that my duty to God is most important, followed by my obligations to my nation and family, followed in third place by my loyalty to Freemasonry. There can be no conflict.

Now, you having asked a lot of questions and have received answers to them, perhaps it is time for some feedback from you:

1) Do you now accept that Freemasonry is not a religion?
2) Do you now accept that there is no link between Masonry and Satanism?
3) Do you now accept that Masonry takes no position or stand on any religion?
4) Your complaint about secrecy has also just been answered. Your thoughts now, please?


Mar 25, 2015
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		4ever learning
by: Anonymous

Assalamu alaikum and hello to all.

Tharn thank you for joining our discussion, your answers are also appreciated.

So if a Freemason was requested in a court to explain freemasonry teachings/rituals etc you would actually view that as immoral?

How so?

Thanking you in advance.
Mar 25, 2015
Rating
star 		I think I answered that question already
by: Tharn

It's a discussion. Now it's your turn:

1). Do you now accept that Freemasonry is not a religion?

2) Do you now accept that there is no link between Masonry and Satanism?

3) Do you now accept that Masonry takes no position or stand on any religion?

4) Your complaint about secrecy has also been answered. Your thoughts on that, please.

Thank you for your responses...

Mar 25, 2015
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		When should I reveal Masonic secrets?
by: Tim

"If one is in a court of law and they are requested by the ruler of the court to explain the secrets/rituals/teachings and ins and outs of freemasonry, what is the outcome?"

Greetings 4ever learning. This is indeed a good question, and one that required a bit of pondering on my part to answer. While no man can say with certainty what his behavior will be in a given situation, and I would not presume to say how other Masons should behave in such a situation, I can say how I hope and believe I would behave.

I took my Masonic obligations in the presence of God, and did solemnly and sincerely promise and swear to keep those obligations. To do otherwise, regardless of the situation, would be dishonorable.
Apr 07, 2015
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		Tim and the rest evil masons...............stop d brainwash
by: Anonymous

It surprises me so much when i c a muslim being fascinated by masonic devils, it is only due to lack of islamic knowledge dat a muslim can go so low to becoming a freemason. The masons pretend to be friendly, use deceptive words and phrases to lie and decieve illitrates....they claim that its on d platform of universal brotherhood they unite......which is a blatant lie.......masons are indeed concrete liars, mafias, free mason does not only have connection with satanism, rather it is satanism itself,
yes it is a fact that they encourage universal brotherhood but not for good, rather to unite in doing evil, committing the worst of deeds, committing d most shameful deed one can ever imagine, perpetrating crimes, infact do u know dat any where around the world there is insurgency, terrorism, and violence, it is directly linked to masonic devils, wallahi including d so called BOKO HARAM in the north eastern part of Nigeria. in summary the main aim of masons is to enjoin every body in d universe into satanism. they will cast an islamic name to a terrorist group, and use that group against islam and muslims, eg bokoharam of nigeria,.
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as a muslim u must need to understand dat the whole activities of bokoharam centres on "war against islam" so it will be ridiculous of a muslim to be attracted to freemason.
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the use strategies such as music industries, to get people into satan worship. because the musician is devil worshipper, while u dat listen to d music worships the musician, automatically u worship d devil, and they have gotten an uncountable number of people with that. another tool they use is DEMOCRACY and other ridiculous system of government to get people into satan worship.
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but allah has clearly and explicitly warned us in d holy Scripture, the shaytaan is an enemy to u (mankind or sons of adam) therefore regard him as ur enemy...............
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wallahi shaytaan can never and will never wish good for mankind or sons of adam
Apr 07, 2015
Rating
star 		Proof?
by: Tharn

And your evidence for your claims that we Freemasons are Satanist, a mafia, terrorists and so forth would be what?

I have Muslim brethren in Freemasonry, respect them and support them. I have on the other hand never met a Muslim who saw with his own eyes what Freemasonry is about claim such silliness; such ravings do little to show the religion of peace in a favorable light.
Apr 11, 2015
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		Free mason, is deceit.
by: muzzammil

I want tim couch to respond to me, why is he being afraid of me? Tim come out and refute my claims. tim, and other freemasonic devils, its high time u accept Allah, accept prophet Muhammad, as God's messenger, and he is a slave of Allah. for only u do dat u will go to heaven..................... but when after u av heard d truth, u still refuse to accept it, den u and ur likes will become doomed for hell fire..........Wallahi Tallahi anybody dat dies as a free mason,......will go to hell and dwell therein forever...
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free mason practice d worst form of evil magic 2day, but people dont know, they are just attracted by d name free mason, which is a deciet.....daz why i call masons, liars, criminals, fraudsters, decievers etc
Apr 12, 2015
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		4ever learning
by: Anonymous

Assalamu alaikum and hello to all.

Tim I appreciate your answers and willingness to express the truth.

I have a query, when one joins into the fraternal brotherhood of freemasonry he does so by swearing an oath to God to uphold the secret rituals of freemasonry. This can be explained why the secrets have not entirely been revealed.

What I query is that if you realise you are performing a disservice to God by continuing on with freemasonry and choose to leave the fraternal brotherhood, would one feel the need to inform others who are not Freemasons of this disservice so they do not make the same mistake of joining freemasonry and perpetrating down a wrong path and away from God?

Are there any Muslims or non Muslims out there who have chosen to leave the fraternal brotherhood that is freemasonry that would care to explain why they chose to leave?

Thanking you in advance.
Apr 12, 2015
Rating
starstarstar 		Deception..
by: Tim

muzzammil,

Are you someone I should fear? Are you not an adherent of the religion of peace?

I have heard no claims that need be refuted. Only ridiculous accusations that any person with knowledge of the true teachings and principles of Freemasonry will tell you are untrue.

If these are the things you believe to be true about Masons and Freemasonry then yes, you are deceived.

Peace be upon you, and upon us all.
Apr 12, 2015
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		A man's path...
by: Tim

4ever Learning,

Thank you for your continued interest and contributions to this discussion.

I believe that if a man determines he is on the wrong path, he should alter his path. Should he also endeavor to alter the paths of others? This is indeed a good question.

The choices we make determine our path, and we can surmise our future only so far as the next bend or dip or horizon. We choose based on the best information available to us but that information is limited, and thus we are fallible in our choices. Let us say that a man determines the path he is on leads not toward the destination he wants, but instead away from it. He alters his path and sets off in a new direction. Along the way, he informs those he meets that they are likewise on a wrong path and encourages them to join him or choose anew. During his travels he gains new information, makes new discoveries, and realizes that his assessment of the earlier path was in error. Is he then responsible to find those whom he directed away from that path and correct his instruction? Or, will further information and discoveries again illuminate the path in a new and different light? We are responsible to help, aid and assist those we meet along our path. This would include warning them of approaching danger, but we are not endowed with an ability to see the future and thus must be ever watchful that our endeavors to help do no harm.

The teachings of Freemasonry conflict with no religion. This is what is taught and what I have learned. In my opinion, those who perceive a conflict are misunderstanding or misinterpreting the teachings of Freemasonry, the teachings of the religion, or both.

In answer to your question, an honorable man will do what he believes is right even though time and experience may prove him wrong.

Peace be upon you brother, and upon us all.

Tim
Apr 17, 2015
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		Allah said in Qur'an 2:102
by: Muzzammil

Surah Al-Baqara, Verse 102:
وَاتَّبَعُوا مَا تَتْلُو الشَّيَاطِينُ عَلَىٰ مُلْكِ سُلَيْمَانَ وَمَا كَفَرَ سُلَيْمَانُ وَلَٰكِنَّ الشَّيَاطِينَ كَفَرُوا يُعَلِّمُونَ النَّاسَ السِّحْرَ وَمَا أُنزِلَ عَلَى الْمَلَكَيْنِ بِبَابِلَ هَارُوتَ وَمَارُوتَ وَمَا يُعَلِّمَانِ مِنْ أَحَدٍ حَتَّىٰ يَقُولَا إِنَّمَا نَحْنُ فِتْنَةٌ فَلَا تَكْفُرْ فَيَتَعَلَّمُونَ مِنْهُمَا مَا يُفَرِّقُونَ بِهِ بَيْنَ الْمَرْءِ وَزَوْجِهِ وَمَا هُم بِضَارِّينَ بِهِ مِنْ أَحَدٍ إِلَّا بِإِذْنِ اللَّهِ وَيَتَعَلَّمُونَ مَا يَضُرُّهُمْ وَلَا يَنفَعُهُمْ وَلَقَدْ عَلِمُوا لَمَنِ اشْتَرَاهُ مَا لَهُ فِي الْآخِرَةِ مِنْ خَلَاقٍ وَلَبِئْسَ مَا شَرَوْا بِهِ أَنفُسَهُمْ لَوْ كَانُوا يَعْلَمُونَ

And they followed what the Shaitans chanted of sorcery in the reign of Sulaiman, and Sulaiman was not an unbeliever, but the Shaitans disbelieved, they taught men sorcery and that was sent down to the two angels at Babel, Harut and Marut, yet these two taught no man until they had said, "Surely we are only a trial, therefore do not be a disbeliever." Even then men learned from these two, magic by which they might cause a separation between a man and his wife; and they cannot hurt with it any one except with Allah's permission, and they learned what harmed them and did not profit them, and certainly they know that he who bought it should have no share of good in the hereafter and evil was the price for which they sold their souls; had they but known this.
(English - Shakir)

May 03, 2015
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		The 2 Islams
by: Anonymous

Allah Be Praised: Al-Islam Has Been Split Apart, And The Mind Of Many Believers Have Been Given To Fictions. Many Have Lost The Reality Of Allah And Have Been Snared By The Luciferian Light Of Darkness
. This Light Of Darkness Has Usurpated Al-Islam And
Formed A Fiction With Endless Mysteries. Though We Have Billions Of Believers Most Are Blind Deaf And Dumb Because They Cannot Read And Write. No True Believing Muslim Can Ever Be A Luciferin Shatanist,
Because That Is Exactly What A Freemason Is. Nothing
But A World Of Secrecy Where You Are Blinded With The Light Of Darkness. There Are Many Kinds Of Light
That Guide, And Light That Blind You. The Luciferin Have Infiltrated All The Religions And Made Fictions Out Of Them So You Cannot Tell The Real One From The Fake, The Last Example Was Prophet Muhammad Trust NONE BUT ALLAH.....
May 06, 2015
Rating
starstarstar 		Masonic purposes
by: Tim

Freemasonry is not a religion, nor does it's philosophy conflict with any religion. We are not in any way aligned with Satan, nor are we Luciferian Shatanist. If these are the things you believe you understand nothing of the true purposes of Freemasonry. We are a fraternal organization working to do good in the world. Nothing more. Nothing less.
May 10, 2015
Rating
star 		My Love...To my Creator..One who creates me...From start to end..JUST ONE GOD..ALLAH
by: Ali..shia of the Ali the The Heidar

Theres only One God..One who created all thing and life for us...Allah Is only power and only way to be in peace!
All Freemasons just Guide you to Satanic way of life..In Way that you lose your pure soul to Satan...
NEVER BEALIVE IN FREEMASONARY
OR YOU WILL FAIL

coz bealiving in supreme being means bealive that you wanna sell your soul to demon and this life....
Theres a Reason in creatures and its human
human is seprated from animals...coz human have choice of selection and thinking...
So God Sent Us to Earth to understand us how we can be with this powers..
Thers hope...thers God...Only and One God...Allah

ALLAH THE BEST...THE KIND....AND THE GENEROUS...
May 10, 2015
Rating
starstar 		@ Ali shia haidar, or whatever ur stupid name is
by: Muzzammil

u beter stop deceiving urself, condemning Freemasonry, they are ur brothers, if actually u dont know dat the shias and d jews have several traits in common, and they agree with each other then u must be a fake shia............ free masons are kaafirs, enemies of Allah and rasul, shias propagats Freemasonry, Allah(s.w.t) told us dat d kaafirs will never agree with u or like u, until u leave ur religion for theirs. so shias are great kafirs, kafirs of the worst order. so in essence is brother Ali what am trying to pass to u is that u either revert to islam, because u are not a muslim or stop condemning dem because its an act of ignorance. how can u be condemning ur right hand partner. daz ignorance
May 21, 2015
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		Good post
by: Mr. Annie Weimann

Absolutely with you it agree. In it something is and it is good idea. I support you., Many thanks.
Jun 21, 2015
Rating
star 		Is it needed or halal for a
by: Abdurrahman AS-SALAFY (Nigeria)

Assalaamu alaikum, with due respect to all, i'm appreciating this discussions, firstly my advise to you Ali shia is to go and seek a sunnatic history of shia from good scholars not shias, because a thief will never claim he's a thief he will deprive you, in islamic history of shia, shia was found after the death of our prophet (pbuh) by Abdullahi Alyahudy who was a jew and many of persian leaders because islam demolish their idolistic religion, and in other side the Fouders of freemason are jews (great enemies of islam) and they found many organisations under freemason eg: UN,WHO,UNICEF etc just to deceive people and saying they are helping people (but with their unpleasant plans against muslims) and claimimg fraternity but in their mind they are unscrupulous and doing unsavory.

And to those illiterate muslims that are arguing that its not haraam you better know that when you reached high level degree in masonic you will be obliged to commit obnoxious jobs for them against Islam by the secret oath you take to them, hmm they are saying its not religion its philosophy, why cant you read the Qur'an for good philosophy without enemies (Kufr), please my dear muslim brothers be pensive and perceptive, the word fraterny they're saying is repudiate and its reputed. They revocked that muslim will not enter paradise Qur'an 2:111, and they are your great enemies they will never accept you Q2:120, so even if they said its not religion ask yourself first are they muslims? NO! So why should i fratern to them? (ALLAH SAID THEY ARE YOUR ENEMIES), and even if they said they're providing aid, distribution or whatever you too can do that without them, you can be a philanthropist and help others in islamic way without there help, as a muslim you do not allowed or supposed to join any organisation by kufr (your enemies) except if you were forced (ALLAH IS ALL KNOWING), i think when they deceive you with words like aid and fraternity you hastly agreed without realizing they are your enemies, pls my brothers and sisters use Qur'an and Hadith as your great philosophies and let them wrap their hatred on Isalam.

Jazakumullah khair to All brothers and sisters, May Almighty Allah advance us in ilm and make jannatul firdaus as our final abode.
Jun 25, 2015
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		Alhamdulillah...thanks U all Brothers N sisters
by: Muhammad Ali (Nigeria)

firstly I will like to call your attention sir with these Quations:-

1- As a Muslim Member,why will i join them?
2- if i will not join them,Am i stop helpin my Religion?
3- What Freemason will give me to help my Religion?
4- Are they against muslim rules (mason's rule)?


No.1
there is no need of joinin such kind of an organization,thats created by jews(freemason)....being am not a member will not stop me from helping my religion...and islam has explain to us that "jews are enemies of islam".there is no need of bringin them in our religion.rather u have to go to islamic scholers and learn more about islamic monodesm

No.2
freemason will not stop me from helpin my religion being am not a member of them.then why should i join them?,to help me?..look how many people are they helping islam without joining this organisation?.most of the people that are join it are just joining for their individual needs not to help the religion

No.3
always they use to say that they are bringing Peace and teaching honesty in an environment.Capital Lie.if its their motto every country will allow them to share it within an environment.but not.why? we dont know;moreever they are sayin its secret

No.4
of curse.masons rule are against islam Rule.mason with higher degree are worshiping devil..and this
against islam monodesm (one Allah).


However.u as a muslim member no need of joining such kind of an organisation.if u are interesting to help islam.u dont need to be a member(i.e freemason).there is many way that u can help your religiou not to join the jewz.
with my these little explanation will enlight you not to join the freemason
Jul 04, 2015
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		Whats Missing?
by: Anonymous

Salaams and hello all.
I'm not a Mason but have read a lot on the subject as it is fascinating regardless if you agree with it or not.
I am a Muslim and believe that Islam provides everything one could need from a spiritual & physical aspect and is an actual way of life not just a religion... but I guess any other individual can say that about their own religion too...
However to be able to find peace in this matter and to be content means one must have compelte faith in their religion.This is where the problem begins...
In most cases an individual joins Masonry as they have a feeling deep inside that something is missing or that there is more to this world/ life then what they know or have been lead to believe. Joining a group like the Masons can provide that sense of beloging but any true Muslim will understand that to feel detached from the world is actually a good thing as if your belief is true you will know that you are not created for this world so why should you feel like you belong?
Islam teaches us to be open in our faith and practices... Masons practice behind closed doors. A Muslim generally can be spotted by their appearance, Masons hide their identity and can only be known by another Mason. Yes Masons require its members to believe in God or a higher power but Islam teaches that there is only one God... so as a Muslim how can you join a group that openly promotes the beliefe in anything but Allah? In doing so what are you saying that the other memebers beliefes are equal to your own if thats true then why are you still a Muslim? Why not become a Hindu, Christian or Jew?
If something feels like its missing then as a Muslim advising another Muslim I would suggest you reconect with Allah by learning about what Islam is... at aged 18 you can not claim to know all there is to know about Islam. May Allah guide us all!
Jul 14, 2015
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		Mansonry is a cult
by: Anonymous

Salam, if masonry is not a scocery, and also not an occult, why does it use HORUS EYE, PYRAMID OF PHAROE, & BAPHOMETH as an symbol ?
Jul 19, 2015
Rating
starstarstarstar 		The problem with symbols...
by: Tim

Symbols have no intrinsic meaning on their own. They mean what people say they mean, and their meaning often changes over time. The symbols you refer to and others like them have certain meaning in today's popular culture, but the legends and teachings of Freemasonry are ancient. In Freemasonry these symbols have very different meanings that have nothing to do with those associated with them today.

Freemasonry, like most things in life, can not be understood from without. To attempt to do so would be akin to standing in the street outside a building and attempt to describe its interior. Even with pictures and a written description the building can not be fully appreciated without physically walking its halls and touching its walls. A competent understanding of Freemasonry requires much study, introspection and experience.

One cannot fairly judge what one does not know.
And how can one know what one does not know?
If one must assume, assume one does not know.
Jul 19, 2015
Rating
star 		Tim u are a fraud
by: engr bench muzzy

indeed u are one of the human devils that exist on earth. and exhibit human qualities..

Freemasonry is a devilish fraternity
..

for ur information mr TIM, there is nothing fair in freemason, there is nothing Good about masonry.....


free masonry is solely built on evil. they use evil ways to propagate evil things, they get everyone doing evil...

Tim.

u people can never dim the light of islam


Allah has declared that ".....he will make his religion (islam) peevail over other religions, even if the kafirs(TIM and d rest masons and All other kafirs round d world) hate it.....

islam will always be there to refute ur claims...

ISLAM IS A GUIDANCE FOR MANKIND

YOU PEOPLE CAN KILL MUSLIMS...But u can never kill islam..


once again.

A MUSLIM CAN NEVER BE A MEMBER OF FREE MASON ELSE IS NO LONGER A MUSLIM
Jul 20, 2015
Rating
starstarstarstar 		Along went a spider...
by: Tim

Funny, I don't feel like a devil. I certainly don't think of myself as evil. I think of myself as a decent, simple man doing the best I can, and sometimes failing, in a complicated world. I did kill a spider earlier today. Does that make me evil? I wonder.

I was clearing away some clutter in a shed when I saw him. I killed him because I was afraid he might bite me. I felt guilty afterwards. Does a devil feel guilt?

He made no threatening move. He was not aggressive in any way. The threat he presented was in my perception of his capabilities, and my fear of what he might do to me. I couldn't communicate with him; I couldn't reason with him. All I could do was make sure he couldn't do what I was afraid he might. Is that evil? Is fear what causes otherwise normal people to do evil things?

Are the peoples of the world at odds because we don't communicate, because we won't rely on reason? Do we allow our fear of one another's perceived capabilities and intentions drive us to say things and do things we would ordinarily never do? Is it truly better to kill rather than risk a measure of trust in nature? Should I have trusted the spider to not bite me? I don't know. And now, I never will.

Fraternally yours,

Tim
Jul 20, 2015
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		muslims vs masons
by: Anonymous

I got on this site to see what the difference of a mason and a Muslim was. But all I read is more hatred for one another than any belief I am in a predicament where I'm with someone and he claims to be Muslim but to me from me knowing a family of Muslims I really don't see it.

Then there's he claims he's also a mason. So to me the only things that he saids and does I'm just not understanding his meaning.

See I'm a Christian and I also want to know is it possible for a Christian and a Muslims/mason to be together? He despises Christians so I feel as if that's hatred towards me and most. And one thing I do know there is no hatred in Muslims if they are true Muslims..

Help I'm drowning in all this madness.
Jul 21, 2015
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		Muslims and Masons
by: Tim

Dear Anonymous,

I'm sorry your life seems so chaotic at this time.

Before I get to your question I need to address something you said regarding, "hatred for one another," on this page. Over the years I have read every post on this page at least once and I don't recall any Mason posting anything hateful. There have been times of frustration. I've experienced some of those myself, but never hatred. If you saw something posted by a Mason on this page that your consider hateful please let us know so that we can address it. Thank you.

Now, to the issue at hand. While I can not know whether the someone you're with is truly a member of the Masonic fraternity, I can categorically state that his behavior as you describe it is entirely contrary to the teachings of Freemasonry. There is no hatred in true Masons either. Religious tolerance is one of our hallmarks and we insist upon it in our lodges. Men of all established religions are welcome in Masonry, but we are taught and expected to practice tolerance toward the faiths of all other members.

I can't advise what you should do, but I can tell you what I would say to my sister in a similar situation. I would tell her, "Sister of mine, I love you. You are with a man who despises your faith and all people of your faith. I know you may be hoping he will change in time, but I can promise you that while you're hoping he will change he is expecting you will. Why would you want to be with someone whom you want to change, and who wants to change you? You deserve to be loved and cherished for the person you are, not for the person someone wants you to be."

Good luck sweet sister, and kindest regards.

Fraternally,

Tim
Jul 21, 2015
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		@ Muslims vs Masons
by: Anonymous

Salaams and Hi hope all is well with you?

Not sure I can be much help but figured I'd try. From my understanding you are with someone who claims to be both a Muslim and a Mason, however their actions and character don't match your view of what a Muslim or a Mason should be.
Islam like all religions teaches a person to have good morals, to be kind and considerate to others this is based around the "sunnah" (example) of Prophet Mohammed (SAW). Masons require men of a sound moral code to be accepted in to the brotherhood. (not saying I agree with Masonry, but its what they claim).
Every individual has his/ her faults and by the sounds of it your unintentionally judging both Islam and Masons based on the individual you are with and their actions/ character.
Like all those that claim to love Allah/ God or believe in him many say the words but don't live their day to day life demonstrating this love or faith.
its difficult to say without knowing exactly what this person is doing that makes you doubt if what they claim to be as a Muslim or a Mason is true.
I am a Muslim but if I behave or act in a manner which contradicts my Islamic faith then you could argue it makes me a hypocrite to an extent, I say this as only Allah knows whats in a persons heart. On a general scale most people act in accordance whit whats truly in their heart. Any true believer will not have hate towards another person but a human being will naturally dislike a type of person that has done them wrong and that negative feeling will come from a personal experience, but even so if they have faith they will battle with this hate/ anger or ill will as they know it to be wrong.
Most of the hate you come across in any aspect of life even on this site are from people that hate another group of people with no real reason to just because they have been told to or lead to believe they should.
I no of no reason why a Muslim should hate a Christian when Islam accepts Issa/ Jesus and the 2nd coming of of Issa. Even freemason's are "hated" by Muslims and others but I'm willing to bet if you ask each individual person if a Mason has directly done them wrong the answer would be "No!".
The prophet Mohammed (SAW) said we should hate the sin not the person as a person can change and stop the sin... people should reflect on this before they post on such sites and be clear to differentiate between hating a Muslim, Christian or a Freemason and should instead say they don't agree with what the person dose and avoid making personal insults to the individual.
Islam teaches tolerance and expects the same in return. Do not judge any faith by its people its like judging a sports car when you have a bad driver behind the wheel.
Hope this helps.
Sep 12, 2015
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		Planning to join Freemasonry
by: Anonymous

Hi

I am planning to join freemasonry. Attended an information evening at one of the grand lodges of Australia. Met with the freemasons. In response to a question from one of the prospective member like me they told that religion and politics are never discussed here and they are your personal matters. To a question from a prospective member as to why it is mandatory to have faith in supreme being and why a person who does not believe in the existence of God cannot be freemason if it is really a non religious organisation, we were told that it is not a non religious organisation, it is actually an all religions organisation where people of all religions are welcome.

I would request TIM to kindly elaborate this in his own unique way (which I have found easier to understand)

Thanks in anticipation.
Sep 16, 2015
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		The Purpose of Freemasonry...
by: Tim

Dear Anonymous,

Thank you for visiting Masonsmart and for this interesting question. Congratulations on your interest in joining the fraternity, and I commend you on attending an informational meeting. You obviously paid attention. I hope I may be of some help.

It is true that religion and politics are not discussed during our lodge meetings. The reason for this is pretty simple. The Lodge is intended to be a place of peace and harmony. Politics and religion, in my opinion, are the two most divisive topics ever devised by the minds of men. It would be virtually, if not literally, impossible to maintain an environment of peace and harmony while discussing these topics.

As to the requirement of a belief in the Supreme, that is considerably less simple to explain. I'm not sure I can offer a satisfactory answer, but I'm happy to offer my thoughts on the matter. First I should mention that no one speaks for Freemasonry. While these are the thoughts and opinions of a Freemason they do not represent an official position of the Masonic fraternity, or for that matter any other Freemason.

Freemasonry is intended to be a journey of self discovery. It takes a man by the hand and acts as an aid and guide in seeking answers to life's great questions regarding existence: who am I, from whence do I come, why am I here, what is my purpose, what comes next...? In short, the teachings of Freemasonry deal with the metaphysical and the spiritual. If a man believes in nothing beyond the material world, if he believes in no power greater than himself, if he can not allow for the unimaginable and the inconceivable, then the benefits and privileges of Freemasonry would be wasted on him.

The requirement of belief in the Supreme is not intended to exclude anyone from membership but to restrict membership to those who are prepared to benefit by it. Just as a Mason must be prepared to advance to each successive degree, a man must first be duly and truly prepared to become a Mason.

I hope this helps. I apologize for my delayed response. I've been little under the weather lately. If I can be of further assistance please let me know.

Fraternally yours,

Tim
Sep 17, 2015
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		4ever Learning
by: Anonymous

Assalamu alaikum and hello to all, Tim I hope you have been well, it's been a while.

Okay so within freemasonry (not all as some differ) the 33rd degree is the knights templar, and the accomplishment after that is The Knights Malta (Nelson Mandela was a Malta) also known as The Hospitallers.

My question is, seeing as though during The Crusades the Templars and Maltas committed some atrocities against the Muslims and others.

The Templars and Maltas even ate those they fought, men, women, kids, they even ate whole villages.

As a Muslim, why would one wish to join an organisation that names different levels and accomplishments after those that committed these atrocities? Especially towards Muslims?

Looking forward to hearing from you.
Sep 19, 2015
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		The choice...
by: Tim

Greetings 4ever Learning. I am reasonably well, thank you. I hope you are, also.

Before we get to your question I should offer a point of clarification. The 33rd Degree is an honorary degree of the Scottish Rite of Freemasonry, while the Knights Templar and the Order of Malta are orders within the York Rite of Freemasonry. The Scottish and York Rites are separate Masonic bodies with the 33rd Degree being the final degree of the Scottish Rite and the Knights Templar being the final degree of the York Rite. The Order of Malta is the order just prior to that of the Knights Templar, with both of them being among the orders known as the Chivalric Orders. This is the structure of the orders within American Freemasonry, however I understand it is considerably different in the U.K. I only mention it because it is an important distinction among Masons, although it has no real bearing on your question.

History is a fascinating subject. It has been said that history is written by the victors but that's not really true, is it? In any given conflict, unless there is only one survivor, there will be mutilple versions of what happened and why. Even among the victors there will be differing versions of events and causality. It only requires a brief journey through the several versions of history surrounding the times of the Crusades to see that atrocities were most likely committed by both sides, Christian and Muslim.

While this is a sad statement on mankind it is not all that surprising. It was a time of war. During wartime, when the reality of death is ever present and always near, people will do things they would otherwise never do. Even the fact that man, supposedly the most advanced species on the planet, can not resolve their differences without the necessity of violence is in itself an atrocity.

Would it surprise you, 4ever Learning, to learn that very few westerners know anything of the history of which you speak? Not because they are uneducated but because they have simply been told a different story. The history most familiar to the west is that the Knights Templar and the Knights of Malta, or Knights Hospitallers, were formed only in response to the barbarism and brutality of the Muslim hordes towards the peaceful Christians. Is it any wonder that Muslims and Christians find common ground so elusive when even their histories are so diametrically opposed? I suspect that the true history lay somewhere in the middle of the two, and is lost to us forever. However, I harbor no illusions that there is not some truth in both.

History is a great tool for learning, but it is not and should never be taken to be written in stone. It is always colored by the biases of the author. We can choose to carry the weight of grudges and blame for acts committed in centuries past, and history, in some version, will eventually repeat itself. Or, we can choose to learn from the lessons of history with an awareness that all is not as we have been told, and chart a new course, a new history, a new path, together.

The choice is ours.

Thank you for your question. Peace be upon you and upon us all.

Fraternally yours,

Tim
Oct 15, 2015
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		Good
by: Greg Sheen

It is possible and there are several ways you can reach out to Fraternity. Whether you can become a Freemason depends more on the government of the country in which you live than your chosen religion. Good men of all faiths are welcome to petition for membership in the fraternity, but the governing powers in some countries do not allow Freemasonry to exist as an organization.

Freemasonry teaches freedom, equality and truth. If these teachings are not a constitutional part of the government in your country then organized Freemasonry may not exist there. However, this does not mean that the teachings are any less valid or important.
Oct 15, 2015
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		4ever learning
by: 4ever learning

Assalamu alaikum and hello to all.

Tim I thank you for taking the time to answer my question in detail.

An earlier claim by yourself on this forum is that masons use 'fictional stories' of the prophets (peace be upon them) that decree and represent the different degrees of ascention in freemasonry.

I am puzzled by this claim, as you and other masons have also stated that one of the main teachings of freemasonry is 'truth'.

I look forward to hearing your explanation of the above.

Thanking you in advance.
Oct 19, 2015
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		it is defently HARAM!
by: Anonymous

No they are devil worshipers haram how can you let them brain wash you your stronger than this
Oct 19, 2015
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		Pythias
by: A Knight in service of the One God

I know my question is not based on Islam or Christianity tho we worship the same God also the same God as the Hebrews but my question is this... What are the connections between the Freemasons and the Knights of Pythias?
Oct 20, 2015
Rating
starstarstar 		Masonic allegory...
by: Tim

Hello 4ever learning, and welcome back.

I do not recall, and would be very surprised to learn, that I had referred to the teachings of Freemasonry as "fictional stories." As a method of teaching or imparting knowledge Masonry often uses allegory. These allegories are never presented as historical fact. They are used symbolically to impart and impress a particular lesson upon the student. A stated lesson, such as 'be a good person' may be easily forgotten, but when presented in allegory it is hoped that the lesson will make an impression that the student will wish to emulate throughout his life.

I hope this helps clear up any puzzlement. Thanks for the question.

Fraternally,

Tim
Oct 20, 2015
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		Islam, Quran, and actions of Prophet
by: Light of Avrahom

Shalom, Salaam, and peace to everyone. Islam, Quran, and actions of Prophet Mohammad gave us all the understanding to follow the straight path to achieve eternal life in paradise. If you ponder the teachings, lower your ego, realize that everything has a purpose and is part of the ultimate design of the one creator you will become enlightened and reached the so called 33rd level.

The problem resides in the fact that as humans we are weak and do not want to, or know how to, work towards perfecting ourselves and adjusting behaviors and desires that hinder our personal self growth.

You must be a seeker of knowledge, you must believe in the "One" magnificent creator, for "You" are merely a speck of dust in the midst of the creation.

Some need organized groups to achieve this, some naturally become Awliya Allah. (friend of God)(sainthood)

Oct 25, 2015
Rating
star 		Misc
by: Lant

1. Thee is no connection between Freemasonry and the Knights of Pythias. Some men may have been or may be members of both, but there is no other link.

2. As to the Knights Templar and the Hospitalers, both orders arose in a turbulent time. The dominant religion around most of the Mediterranean Sea was Christianity from the late Roman Empire time until the arrival of Islam. There were five holy cities in Christianity - Rome, Constantinople (now Istanbul, of course), Alexandria, Jerusalem and Antioch. With the arrival of Islam, Christian lands from the south of what is now Turkey all the way to almost France were conquered by the new faith. Three of the holy cities were under Muslim control and the fourth threatened.

Without attempting to blame or praise either religion, it was a rough time. Reports of ill-treatment of Christian pilgrims was the initial stated reason for the Crusades, but the rising power of post-Dark Age kingdoms in Europe made conflict almost inevitable. Once the first Crusade had recaptured a toehold in what is now Syria, Israel, etc, the problem became how to defend it. In the centuries to follow, the monastic warrior groups proved effective to that end.

It is a matter of history that appalling atrocities were committed by both sides over the next few centuries. (I doubt either side actually made a practice of cannibalism, however.) Moreover, it is important to recognize that religion was just one factor and things like growing populations, economics and simple human greed played their own part. Since then, both sides have written history to suit themselves. Not a pretty time, in all truth.
Oct 25, 2015
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		To Lant
by: A Knight in service of the One God

Lant thank you so very much I was wondering more for the charity reasons and of course the history appreciate your help
Oct 26, 2015
Rating
star 		To a Knight
by: Lant

You are welcome, sir. Perhaps you could remind me of those specific questions.

Tim - WRT the word 'fiction', I believe I did use the word earlier on, calling some of our teaching methods "historical fiction." I think I explained it then, but for those who are still confused, I'll try again.

Masons use symbolism and allegory to teach morality. We use allegorical tales, call them short works of theatre, to drive home some of the key points. Centuries of experience have taught us that this is a good way for those points to be remembered.

Those allegorical tales include historical figures, such as King Solomon. Why him? Probably because Solomon had - and has - a reputation for great wisdom. That respect is nearly universal.

Now, we in fact know relatively little about Solomon. There are some stirring stories in holy books about him, but we know far more about, say, Saladin than Solomon.

So, we have a desire to teach morality and an historical figure with a reputation for great wisdom. To involve him in a morality play would make it 'historical fiction', but nobody is led to believe that the words and actions in the play actually happened; it's just an attempt to use that great man's reputation for wisdom and probity to enhance a lesson.

There is no conflict between this and truth.
Oct 26, 2015
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		Masonry as historical fiction...
by: Tim

Lant,
Well, there ya go. When you explain it like that, 'fictional stories' seems a perfectly apt description of Freemasonic teachings. Thanks.

Fraternally,

Tim
Nov 04, 2015
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		4ever learning
by: Anonymous

Assalamu alaikum and hello to all.

Tim and Lant thank you for your responses.

Tim you stated a very important peice of information:

The Templars and hospitallers were created out of necessity to defeat the Muslims during the time of the crusades.

Now this is an extremely important fact.

To all the Muslims out there reading this who are masons or want to be masons:

Remember that masonry aligns itself and names and awards it's members with degrees that were created to destroy Islam! The main goal of the Templars and hospitallers was to eradicate Muslims and Islam off the face off the earth, this has been admitted above.

Now with this admitted would a Muslim chose to be a mason?
Nov 04, 2015
Rating
starstarstarstar 		My words are not contortionists...
by: Tim

4ever learning,
Your handle is a misnomer. Henceforward, I shall refer to you as 4Never learning.

I wondered how long we'd have to wait for you to show your true colors. Not as long as I thought, and certainly not as creatively as I'd hoped. Your penchant for intentionally misconstruing my words to suit your agenda is becoming irksome.

Since you insist on taking my words out of context I will include the pertinent part of the earlier post here:

"Would it surprise you, 4ever Learning, to learn that very few westerners know anything of the history of which you speak? Not because they are uneducated but because they have simply been told a different story. The history most familiar to the west is that the Knights Templar and the Knights of Malta, or Knights Hospitallers, were formed only in response to the barbarism and brutality of the Muslim hordes towards the peaceful Christians. Is it any wonder that Muslims and Christians find common ground so elusive when even their histories are so diametrically opposed? I suspect that the true history lay somewhere in the middle of the two, and is lost to us forever. However, I harbor no illusions that there is not some truth in both."

I would encourage those interested in the exchange to read it in whole. It's not very long. It begins with
  • the post of Sep 17, 2015 by Anonymous and entitled "4ever Learning";
  • followed by the Sep 19, 2015 post entitled "The choice..." by Tim;
  • and includes additional information and clarification in the post of Oct 25, 2015 entitled "Misc" by Lant.


Nowhere in my words, nor in the teachings or practice of Freemasonry, will you find mention or intention to harm Islam in any way, much less "destroy" it. You're such a drama queen 4Never Learning. The mission of the Knights Templars and of Malta was to protect Christian pilgrims and defend Christian lands from invasion. It is for such noble and chivalric qualities as these that the degrees were created to present.

The crusades was a time of war. Terrible acts were no doubt committed by both sides. It's now time to learn from this episode in history and move forward in peace. This persecution complex that you keep trying to put forth and justify is both dangerous and wearying.

Your agenda here is patently transparent. If you continue in your attempts to fabricate conflict and controversy where none exist you will be banned from the site.

Sincerely,

Tim
Nov 04, 2015
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		4ever learning
by: Anonymous

Assalamu alaikum and hello to all.

Tim I thank you for taking time out of your day to respond to me.

It is disappointing to see that one has taken to personal attacks and threats.

I merely pointed out the fact, which was stated by yourself that the Templars, hospitallers & Maltas were created to defeat the Muslims.

Historians from both sides have recorded that their main aim was to defeat Islam and eradicate Muslims not only from the holy land, but from the earth.

I simply stated another fact, which was stated by yourself that there are Masonic orders who have different degrees named after the Templars, hospitallers and Maltas.

What I did was put the peices together, which you had given me.

I never stated that you had said modern day Templars wished to destroy Islam, that was a piece you wished to place in your own puzzle, to show your agenda.

If you feel that you have to delete me from this group well then please proceed.

However if we are able to continue our line of communication I would much rather that.

Thanking you on advance.
Nov 04, 2015
Rating
starstarstarstar 		Thank you for the reminder...
by: Tim

Dear 4Never Learning,

That wasn't an attack. Though, I can certainly understand why you may have anticipated one. Neither was it intended as a threat. It was a simple statement of fact that twisting the words of others and using them to suit your own narrative is bad form and a no-no. I am surprised you mistook my meaning. You seem quite capable of discerning statements of fact when they can be manipulated to serve your agenda.

Speaking of agendas, thank you for reminding me of mine. My purpose here is to answer legitimate and sincere questions regarding Freemasonry to the best of my ability. I am not a historian. I am just a man and Mason who loves the teachings of Masonry and the gentle craft of being a Mason. I have no expertise nor credentials in the field of history and I should not be dabbling there. I consider all historical accounts to be biased by the perceptions of the recorder. My limited knowledge is therefore biased by my own perceptions of the biased recordings I studied and can not be considered even reliable, much less factual. Therefore I think it only prudent that I leave history to the historians from now on.

In the interest of educating myself, though, something you said in your last post piqued my curiosity. You made the statement that, "Historians from both sides have recorded that their main aim was to defeat Islam and eradicate Muslims not only from the holy land, but from the earth." I would very much like to read these accounts from both sides. Perhaps you would be kind enough to reference some of these historical works for me, and others who may be interested.

Thanking you in advance,

Tim
Nov 07, 2015
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		4ever learning
by: Anonymous

Assalamu alaikum and hello to all.

Tim I thank you for your continued responses.

I would like to begin with sincere apologies for my demeanour in my previous post.

It was never an intention of mine to be harbouring conflict, if this is how I was perceived, it was not my intention.

As a muslim I have a duty to inform other Muslims if something they are doing or intending to do will lead them away from Allah and truth, this was my fuel.

The history of the Templars tells us many things.

Their initial intentions was to provide support to the Christian pilgrims.

As they grew in numbers, they grew in power, wealth and domination.

However what they did lose, was control over themselves.

History has recorded that the Templars were in fact out of control, working towards their own agenda of domination using there power and wealth along with their 'secrets'.

What were the secrets of the Templars?

Why did their intention change?

Was it due to what they discovered in Jerusalem or was it simply the power and wealth and thirst for blood (literally) that took control over them? Maybe it was a mixture of both?

To say they were noble, well this depends on which side of noble you mean.

When it comes to chivalry I would agree. They had a code they lived by, maybe this same code exists today with the masons and Templars.

Whatever the true intention and aim of the Templars, one thing is certain, their chivalry is alive today and is present in the teachings of freemasonry.

In my opinion, should a Muslim wish to reach the degree of Templar or Malta I would think he is deviating from the straight path, the path of truth.

Tim I will evaluate further, however will await your response to the above first.

Thanking you in advance.
Nov 07, 2015
Rating
star 		Olympia-bound
by: Tharn

Were jumping to conclusions an Olympic event, some people wouldn't be able to stand for the weight of their medals...
Nov 07, 2015
Rating
star 		Wait - what?
by: Lant

"History has recorded that the Templars were in fact out of control, working towards their own agenda of domination using there power and wealth along with their 'secrets'. "

Really? What history in particular says they were 'out of control' and 'working towards their own agenda of control'? References, please.


.
"one thing is certain, their chivalry is alive today and is present in the teachings of freemasonry. "

Ditto. Please cite reliable references showing a clear and distinctive link.


.
"...a thirst for blood (literally)..."

Back to the claims about cannibalism again, eh? And you wonder why Tim is getting frustrated? That's not a search for truth, it's an OC fetish for preposterous horror.


.
Your logic is badly skewed. Salah ad-din has actually been cited in some Christian writings as being more chivalrous than many of his Christian opponents. Does that chivalry on his part link him to Freemasonry, too? That a group of gentlemen in the late 1800s adopted the fez (very popular in parts of the Muslim world at the time) as their distinctive headgear - does that make the Shriners somehow pro-Islam?

Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar. Your soi-dissant search for truth and knowledge is becoming a tiresome, fatuous witch-hunt.
Nov 08, 2015
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		4ever learning
by: Anonymous

Assalamu alaikum and hello to all.

Lant it is great to converse with you once more.

Everyone is responsible for their own beliefs and knowledge.

Lant I am a firm believer in that one has to take the time to search the pages of history for themselves. As it is not only the end goal that is the destination, but the journey and learning curve that took you there, I'm sure you can relate to this.

The truth is out there, for all of us to search for and discover for ourselves and I don't believe it is hidden behind secrecy and allegory and only available to a select few of gods creation.

Unless you are able to prove otherwise?

See I believe God has laid out the truth to us many times in many forms since the creation of mankind, for us to discover the truth.

Why would God only allow a very small percentage of his creation to be able to 'lever' themselves closer to him?

Thanking you in advance
Nov 08, 2015
Rating
star 		Still waiting
by: Lant

We have answered a lot of your questions. Perhaps it is time for you to answer some.

1) What reputable source has stated that the Templars were out of control and working towards their own agenda of control?

2) What reputable source has shown that elements of Templar chivalry is present in current Masonic teaching?

Saying, "The evidence is there, go find it for yourself," would get a failing grade in a public school debate club. You made the statements, so it is up to you to provide evidence; it's been that way since the time of Plato.

Your turn, please.
Nov 17, 2015
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		lots of confusion
by: Anonymous

Our lodge secretary is a Muslim.

Some wrong ideas have been posted, such as "worshiping masonry". A mason does not worship masonry; they worship a Supreme Being, whether they are Muslim, Christian, Jewish, Hindu, etc.

Dec 11, 2015
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		3.5 hours later...
by: Reality check

I was up late reading about the Free Masons and the New World Order and Islam, attempting to get insight on the whole truth of the matter. And the only thing I've come up with 3.5 hours later after reading this entire post is:

-4 ever Learning doesn't know when to stop. Over the numerous months and years, he doesn't get it. Are you mental??? I swear, I'm surprised that haven't blocked you. You are as block headed and slick as the night is dark. You act like a jerkoff then switch to a kind well mannered person. Bi-polar perhaps? Give it up already. You're digging for a way to put a twist on a reasonable explanation on why the FreeMasons are "bad." Give it a rest already. Sheesh.

-Tim and Lan- Thank you for putting this all into perspective for me and many others. I've always wondered about the Free Masons and what they stood for. TONS AND TONS of misleading information out there. Keep up the good work guys. God sees the good in what you do for humanity.

Dec 12, 2015
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		Small minded
by: c0rt3x

Freemasonry is not a religion and no worshiping of any sort goes on in the meetings. Freemasons recognize that a person's relationship with his/her own deity is private and let people decide what something means using your own brain and knowledge of the language you get your information from. If you read a sentence in your native tongue then no one can really tell you what that sentence was. As such, when you read the koran you don't need another human being to tell you what you just read. Their message may not be the same one you got out of it. In understanding just that one thing a person may begin to understand what liberty truly is.
Dec 16, 2015
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		Another point of view
by: Abu Awn bin Hashim

Peace to all,

I think that the secret knowledge which people are talking about is discussed in Koran and when it all started. Koran says

"And We certainly gave David from Us bounty. [We said], "O mountains, repeat [Our] praises with him, and the birds [as well]." And We made pliable for him iron,[Commanding him], "Make full coats of mail and calculate [precisely] the links, and work [all of you] righteousness. Indeed I, of what you do, am Seeing."And to Solomon [We subjected] the wind - its morning [journey was that of] a month - and its afternoon [journey was that of] a month, and We made flow for him a spring of [liquid] copper. And among the jinn were those who worked for him by the permission of his Lord. And whoever deviated among them from Our command - We will make him taste of the punishment of the Blaze. They made for him what he willed of elevated chambers, statues, bowls like reservoirs, and stationary kettles. [We said], "Work, O family of David, in gratitude." And few of My servants are grateful.And when We decreed for Solomon death, nothing indicated to the jinn his death except a creature of the earth eating his staff. But when he fell, it became clear to the jinn that if they had known the unseen, they would not have remained in humiliating punishment.(As-Saba, V#10-V#14)

There is an initiation ritual at freemasonry where a story is told about the building of the Temple of Solomon. So I think that the knowledge was given to the mankind through Solomon which was used to construct the temple.

There is another point to be noted that the current structure standing on the temple mount was built in 1033. When the Muslims started the construction of mosque for the first time there was not any temple standing there perhaps most of the site was covered with ruins of second temple which was destroyed by Romans. According to Muslim beliefs Solomon constructed the house of worship and that same building was referred as Masjid Al Aqsa in Koran years before the occupation of Jerusalem by Muslims so they rebuilt that house of worship.

Being a Muslim you do not need to be a Freemason to acquire that concealed knowledge all you need to do is to read the book that you already have and do not just read it study it. You may find wonders once veil is removed. A righteous Muslim is the custodian of that knowledge.

Allah says

It is He who has sent down to you, [O Muhammad], the Book; in it are verses [that are] precise - they are the foundation of the Book - and others unspecific. As for those in whose hearts is deviation [from truth], they will follow that of it which is unspecific, seeking discord and seeking an interpretation [suitable to them]. And no one knows its [true] interpretation except Allah . But those firm in knowledge say, "We believe in it. All [of it] is from our Lord." And no one will be reminded except those of understanding.(Ali Imran, V#7)

Try to be firm in knowledge.
Dec 16, 2015
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		A thoughtful reply, thank you
by: Lant

Abu Awn bin Hashim, it is a pleasure to see such a thoughtful post from a man who obviously is a devout and knowledgable man.

Freemasons make use of the legendary wisdom of Solomon and the construction of the temple built as an allegory for the challenges a man - every man - will be faced with in his life. We include a story of an honourable man facing a severe challenge and how he dealt with it and what lessons can be gained from that. While this story involves Solomon and some other historical figures from holy books, in reality nobody really knows very much about and of those long-dead men because neithr Bible nor Koran gives very much detail. No Mason takes our teaching stories as factual history, in other words. They are just parables, useful in teaching a point of morality. The reality is that Freemasonry has no direct link to Jerusalem, to Solomon or to his temple, nor are there any real secrets passed down over the years to Masonry from Jerusalem, from Solomon or from the building of the temple.

I seriously doubt that any Masons today believe that Freemasonry is the only way to wisdom or moral behaviour; many religions (specifically including Islam) and many philosophies teach the same things - behave honestly, treat all men as worthy of respect, strive to improve yourself morally, etc.

Freemasonry differs from any religion however in that we do not promise salvation, nor explain how to attain salvation. We feel that such matters are between a man and his God and, beyond encouraging every Mason to worship regularly in his own faith, take it no further. Like many other organizations, our meetings open with prayer, but so phrased that each Mason present is praying in his own belief.

Again, thank you for your post. Peace be to you.

Dec 26, 2015
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		confusion
by: Anonymous muslim boy

please help I'm confused of joining or not.all I know abt it is its name....nd I mst remain a muslim
Dec 26, 2015
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		confusion
by: Anonymous muslim boy

Astagfirullah wa atubu elaik for having this thought I WILL REMAIN A MUSLIM INSHA Allah they have nothing to offer me that Allah has not given me so.......once more astagfirullah.
Dec 26, 2015
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		Muslim Freemason
by: Anonymous

I recommend the book: Freemasonry Ancient Egypt and the Islamic Destiny by Mustafa El-Amin. It provides a lot of information about Islam and Freemason.Very good easy read.
Jan 20, 2016
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		About Islam & Freemasonry
by: PM, 32d Scotish Rite & Royal Arch Mason

What I will say has not been discussed until now on this page, unless I missed it. First of all, What is Islam, but submission to God's will? It is pretty simple, right? However, Islam is not just ONE religion: The Muslims of several doctrinal beliefs are split to the point of hating and killing each other.

There are various groups within the two mainstream versions of Islam: Sunnies and Shias. They interpret Islam interpret quite differently, pray differently, act differently, and observe different holidays.

Some groups only believe in Quran and reject everything that was written afterwards (the Sunnah and Hadith), some of them do not bow in prayer and pray silently, because there is nothing about HOW to pray in the Quran itself. More than half of different Muslim practices come from stuff that was written two hundred years after the birth of Islam as religion.

Also, there are different groups practicing mystical Sufism and there is a very secretive version of Shia Islam practiced by the Druze.

MY POINT is that if you are a part of one of the moderate groups, including the Druze and Sufis, that YES, its no problem to join Masonic Brotherhood, but if you come from the Salafi, Wahabi or conservative Shia family, than you probably better not, as this will cause friction with you family.

As a part of the process of becoming a Mason, a committee of three brothers WILL VISIT your home and WILL ASK your mother or your wife if they agree with you becoming a Freemason.

Freemasonry is a brotherhood focused on MUTUAL HELP and support. This is its primary goal, it also practices charity and takes care of the widows and orphans of Masons who passed. Masons swear allegiance to each other, and we stand one by another. To be honest, I do not know the religion of many of my Mason Brothers, and I do not care about it. They believe, love and fear God and that is all it matters.

Good luck!
Jan 21, 2016
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		Confused...
by: Anonymous

I'm 33, an afghan living in NY, and a muslim. I wanted to join freemasonry but had a problem with certain wording and rituals when entering. Also, I wanted to be an insider in a organization to raise prospects of good connections and networking. I realize now that what does it offer that Allah swt doesn't, and do we look for him for more money and better jobs or freemasons? Do we do good for his sake or do good through masonry? Also, why can only those who believe in god join? I know if I were satan trying to mislead good men, I would focus my energy on believers just like masonry does, not athiests or polytheists. Maybe in masonic rituals, men commit shirk without them even knowing? Please help me understand.
Jan 21, 2016
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		I will try to answer your question
by: About Islam & Freemasonry NEW by: PM, 32d Scotish Rite & Royal Arch Mason

There is more than one Masonic Rituals, i.e Prestonian (mostly in the US) and Emulation (mostly in Europe). Each jurisdiction has developed its own version of the ritual. I am talking about regular Masonry here, not the irregular groups or the so called Orient.

If you have ever read Quran, you can not find anything wrong with the Masonic Ritual per se. In the US it is heavily vested in Jewish history, but as you well know, no person can be Muslim without accepting all Jewish Scriptures as TRUE. When you give your oath, you can request Torah or Quran instead of the Bible. When you are asked to say a prayer, you can do so silently, and you can pick a prayer of your choice.

There are two grand Grand Lodges in the Arab countries that I know of: Morocco and Lebanon: from the Lebanese site comes the following explanation: "Freemasonry is kindness in the home; honesty in business; courtesy toward others; dependability in one's work; compassion for the unfortunate; resistance to evil; help for the
weak; concern for good government; support for public education; and above all, a life-practicing reverence for God and love of fellow man".

Now, many on this site ask the same question, WHAT CAN Freemasonry give that God/ G-d/Allah can't give me? Well, this is a mute question. It is the same as asking, What can that University Degree, Masters or a Ph.D. give me that God/ G-d/Allah can't give me? Or what can Playing Team Sports or working out give me that God/ G-d/Allah can't give me?

Masonry does not compete with any religion, it is an opportunity to become a better person: Freemasons will not cheat or steal from a Brother; they will not disrespect a wife, widow, mother, sister or daughter of a Mason, they will not abandon their Brothers if they are in distress (occasional bad apples do exist of course, I am sad to say). Freemasonry reinforces under oath the good behavior preached in all major religions. That is all there is to it.
Jan 21, 2016
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		Concerns about the Masonic Ritual and committing Idolatry.
by: PM, 32d Scotish Rite & Royal Arch Mason

There is more than one Masonic Rituals, i.e Prestonian (mostly in the US) and Emulation (mostly in Europe). Each jurisdiction has developed its own version of the ritual. I am talking about regular Masonry here, not the irregular groups or the so called Orient.

If you have ever read Quran, you can not find anything wrong with the Masonic Ritual per se. In the US it is heavily vested in Jewish history, but as you well know, no person can be Muslim without accepting all Jewish Scriptures as TRUE. When you give your oath, you can request Torah or Quran instead of the Bible. When you are asked to say a prayer, you can do so silently, and you can pick a prayer of your choice.

There are two grand Grand Lodges in the Arab countries that I know of: Morocco and Lebanon: from the Lebanese site comes the following explanation: "Freemasonry is kindness in the home; honesty in business; courtesy toward others; dependability in one's work; compassion for the unfortunate; resistance to evil; help for the
weak; concern for good government; support for public education; and above all, a life-practicing reverence for God and love of fellow man".

Now, many on this site ask the same question, WHAT CAN Freemasonry give that God/ G-d/Allah can't give me? Well, this is a mute question. It is the same as asking, What can that University Degree, Masters or a Ph.D. give me that God/ G-d/Allah can't give me? Or what can Playing Team Sports or working out give me that God/ G-d/Allah can't give me?

Masonry does not compete with any religion, it is an opportunity to become a better person: Freemasons will not cheat or steal from a Brother; they will not disrespect a wife, widow, mother, sister or daughter of a Mason, they will not abandon their Brothers if they are in distress (occasional bad apples do exist of course, I am sad to say). Freemasonry reinforces under oath the good behavior preached in all major religions. That is all there is to it.
Jan 28, 2016
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		Freemasonery
by: Anonymo

No you can't cause freemasonery is all about terrorism and other activities that is forbidden in Islam and if you became Masonic you'll needd to do things and say things that are completely wrong and freemasonery is nothing than a fake Group of terrorists that preTend to be the one who will make the world a better place but it's al a big lie
Jan 29, 2016
Rating
star 		Anonymo
by: Thane

Actually, this is a new one - that Masons are terrorists. How clever.

Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. Your evidence for your assertation is what?
Feb 11, 2016
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		hilarious
by: Anonymous

if I were you I wouldn't even entertain such an Idea as a mason being a terrorist; are all Muslims terrorist?
Mar 03, 2016
Rating
star 		Politics
by: Lant

Who is to blame (this week) and who is the victim (this week) are interesting topics, but not for this forum, I think. Freemasonry is, at least in our tradition, free of politics. We do not discuss it and we do not argue for or against any party.
Mar 03, 2016
Rating
starstarstar 		A good example of what not to do
by: Tim

I agree with Lant. This page is sliding off-topic and becoming a good example of why we don't discuss religion or politics in our lodges. There's nothing to be gained or resolved by taking sides and assessing blame. That's not discussion, it's argument. There are plenty of forums for those purposes. This isn't one of them. The purpose of the Masonsmart site is to discuss Freemasonry, its teachings, ideals and purposes. The topic of this page is "Can a Muslim be a Freemason?" Let's try to keep it in the lane, and keep it civil. Thanks.
Mar 23, 2016
Rating
starstarstarstar 		Ignorance
by: Lawrence Pirkl

My step father ( finish man I have ear known) was a 33rd degree Mason and a Christian. Our family went to the Presbyterian Church every Sunday. I read one comment that ALL Christians hate Muslims and Masons. Total lie or just plain ignorance. Free Masonry is not a religious organization. Any faith can apply to become a Mason. Some faiths forbid their followers to join it is not the Masons that forbid them.
Mar 26, 2016
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		Freemason
by: Anonymous

I am a Muslim and a Mason . However I think at 18 years old you need to think why want to be a mason and need be 100% sure what entitles.Not just a famous thing.Lots of commitment is needed.
Apr 06, 2016
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		Can a female join the free masons?
by: Anon333

I heard that only men were allowed to join the free masons, is that true? Is there a separate fraternity for females? If so, what is it called? and is it common?
Apr 06, 2016
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		Women Freemasons...
by: Tim

Hello Anon333,

It is true that mainstream Masonry is a fraternal organization made up of men. However, the Masonic family of organizations is broad and complex. There are groups and bodies within the umbrella of Masonry for women, as well as those for both women and men. These groups and bodies, though, generally require that the woman be related to a Mason as a condition to membership.

There are also groups and bodies for women which exist outside the mainstream of Masonry. These groups are not officially recognized, but I understand that some do adhere closely to the teachings and tenets of Freemasonry. I am not associated with any of them and so can not vouch for them, but they may be worth a look. Our page, "Can a Woman Become a Freemason?" discusses several of these.

Best regards and thank you for visiting Masonsmart.
May 25, 2016
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		It is indeed hilarious that people would actually believe.
by: the masonic fool and his quest

Dear people consider this, why would a group hide what its doing and claim that its good. Why is everything not open and clear or "illuminated" for all people to see and understand. Why is everything secretive. I think a person who is seeking the truth and enlightenment should be able to learn everything about a particular belief or "brotherhood" before he is expected to follow or join it. Indeed there is no compulsion in religion. So the biggest question is that if you guys are good and claim to be making men better than why is it that you cannot put your information and rituals from top to bottom for the whole world to see. What is it that must be kept so secretive. I ask you this question again or is it that repeating certain phrases over and over again and it's a from of indoctrination that eventually takes away your thought to have logical and rational thought. Dear mason brothers when you will finally reach your final degrees and the truth becomes more and more evident you will realize you are just pawns being used to move pieces. In the end even the king is just a piece on a playing board. Open your hearts and minds to the truth and implore your creator to guide you to it.
May 26, 2016
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		Not
by: Lant

It's not that difficult to explain, but there are two issues.

First, about the rituals or lessons. There is nothing in Freemasonry which is not taught in religion (be it Christianity, Islam or any other) or in mainstream philosophy classes. We strive to make ourselves better men in terms of morality. We teach that men should honour the Creator, strive to better themselves and treat others in the world with charity, respect and mercy. To this extent, Masonry merely reinforces what religion or philosophy teaches. (I do hope you are not claiming that loving the Almighty and treating one's fellow men fairly fly in the face of Islamic teachings? From my readings of the Koran, they seem to be pretty good parallels.)

There is no chanting of phrases and no indoctrination, no loss of free will either, sorry to burst that bubble.

However, from centuries of experience, we have found that to be as effective as possible, the student should be seeing the rituals (or way we teach those lessons) for the first time in the proper setting. Oh yes, we could publish the allegorical teaching tales we use, but out of context they would have little meaning or effectiveness. So those we keep private.

(Actually, virtually nothing we do has not been reported publicly. Go on the internet and everything we do is there - all of it. The trap for the unwary is that those tiny kernels of reality are hidden in huge fields of false information, silly claims and biased reports and there is no way for a non-Mason to know what's true and what's a lie.)

Secondly, a Freemason can be assured of a warm welcome and fraternal assistance virtually anywhere in the world. There are some unscrupulous individuals who would like to take advantage of that, so we have a few private ways of confirming each other's identity.

Outside of those? Hardly anything secret, my friend. Big signs saying who we are. Rings, ball caps, t-shirts announcing our membership. Even websites...

As to compulsion, what compulsion? We use no compulsion whatever, beyond an expectation to behave in a proper fashion and the knowledge that if a member does not, he will be expelled from Freemasonry. Nobody is compelled to join, nobody is compelled to advance in degree, nobody is compelled to stay or learn - or anything.

About learning everything in advance, any young man who wants to become a policeman or soldier must swear an oath of loyalty to the state before they are enlisted. They are also expected to sign some sort of secrecy rules before they see them. Has any army or government agency ever shown a potential employee all the secret files and only then asked them to promise to keep them secret? Of course not. Doctors and lawyers must swear to keep clients' secrets before they even meet the clients. Board meetings of any company are private. My wife and I have private discussions.

Lastly, I have been at the most senior degree in Freemasonry for a long time and have seen absolutely nothing to indicate that I am somebody's pawn or that I am being manipulated. Such fairytales are taught to the credulous by the ignorant and the fearful.

So, a challenge to you, my inquiring friend. Stop listening to the fables taught by those filled with hatred and confusion and think for yourself. Examine all evidence, not just that tossed to you by those wanting to make themselves look important. Make up your own mind.

Peace to you.
May 26, 2016
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		Control.
by: Wrangler

The Masons bar no religion. Some religions bar their followers from being a Mason. Those zealous leaders are afraid of loosing total control of their subjects.
Jun 17, 2016
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		Masonic ethic of religious respect
by: Florence

My beloved father was a Mason until his death. I was a Rainbow girl.. He taught me through his unwavering commitment to respect all who were faithful to God, be they Moslem, Chrristian or Jew. He also lived a life filled with compassion, mercy and justice. As a Rainbow, we were encouraged to follow our faith in active service and respect other's faith. Free Masonry is not a religion, but calls its members to be active in their own faith, good citizens, and devoted to a better human condition for all. Those who believe Masonry is evil need to look in their hearts to find what is bothering them so much.
Jun 17, 2016
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		Masonic ethic of religious respect
by: Florence

My beloved father was a Mason until his death. I was a Rainbow girl.. He taught me through his unwavering commitment to respect all who were faithful to God, be they Moslem, Chrristian or Jew. He also lived a life filled with compassion, mercy and justice. As a Rainbow, we were encouraged to follow our faith in active service and respect other's faith. Free Masonry is not a religion, but calls its members to be active in their own faith, good citizens, and devoted to a better human condition for all. Those who believe Masonry is evil need to look in their hearts to find what is bothering them so much.
Jun 19, 2016
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		God bless
by: Lamt

Thank you for your comments, Florence. Sounds like you and your dad really got along well.
Jun 21, 2016
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		Entered Apprentice
by: No one cares

Freemasonry is a guide towards a life full of responsibility and commitment. men come together in the name of something that is much larger than all. a cause, an ideology that has a goal of driving mankind towards a prosperous and thriving society. Tyrannical and conspiracy theorist tend to make "secret" organizations evil and always with a negative hidden agenda. but the truth is, regardless of whether you are a freemason or if you are in another fraternal organization, these people are gathering to discuss the social, economic and emotional issues that society encounters every single day. who are we to categorize that group of people when we only make speculations based on euphoric thought provoking statements that makes us feel "special" in a way. the world is not all that evil and with the development of technology, people do not have secrets anymore. I am going to submit my petition this week and I can tell you this is one of the most anticipated moments of my life. the chance to become apart of something much larger than I am, WITHOUT having to "sell my soul" like most hippies would say. You are only going to "sell your soul" if you allow your self to do so. Freemasonry is about having a moral compass that will guide you towards the greatest version of yourself. for whoever is reading this, I encourage you that you think that the power of "good" will always overcome the power "evil". and that statement we all should apply to ourselves since we are just as tyrannical and loving as any dictator or missionary. Summon your inner demon that gives you temptations and greed and lust and selfishness. do NOT let that inner demon summon YOU! take control of your life and you will soon realize that the Idea of evil and good is merely an illusion that mankind had developed over the years. we are all capable of good, and we are all capable of bad. Lets be better examples for those to come to this Holy earth so they could one day accomplish the wonders that we hoped for so long to accomplish.
Jul 03, 2016
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		religious conflict?
by: sufiyyah

Do Prince Hall Masons require one to be AA and Christian? It seems like they may be different because their lodges seem to be mostly church based and AA.
Jul 03, 2016
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		as you may fit ; no one can know.
by: Ebnä Hakim

Hello gents,
***
there is, in essence no incompatibility between Islam (understood as an exoteric corpus) and Freemasonry ; if seen as it should be: the attachment to a initiatic organization (an unbreakable contract and fingerprint), an individual engaging in the path, the goal being accessing pure knowledge if capable: conditions and abilities are reunited ; there are dangers: a great contract means great advantages, derogating to the contract means great failings.
***
An initiatic organization is "theoretically" the transmitter of a spiritual influx and in its body the vehicle giving the necessary tools.
***
Is Freemasonry the most fitted for a moslem? I don't know, it depends on his material and also at some point, the surrounding conditions and their states.
***
But in my opinion, for a moslem who fills the interior need, Tassawuf stays the most coherent pathway, especially in this time conditions, where individuals, in general, have strong intellectual deformities even if they don't see them due to their profane educational background.
***
Anyways, making this sort of decision: this is a serious matter, it needs to be thought, meet with people in real life. Godspeed.
***
Cordially.
Jul 05, 2016
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		Not likely
by: Lant


Sufiyyah: Do Prince Hall Masons require one to be AA and Christian? It seems like they may be different because their lodges seem to be mostly church based and AA.

It's most unlikely. If you visit the websites of the various PH grand lodges, you will see no reference to either Christianity or AA being required. Indeed, to limit admitance to Christians would be a violation of one of the most basic Masonic principles, that of being open to men of all faiths.

As to having to belong to AA, I find that even more unlikely, although there is a tiny grain of truth in it, which is hat, unlike those in other countries, most Masonic facilities in the USA are specifically 'dry' - no alcohol. (That hasn't stopped a path being worn in the sidewalk from the hall to the nearest bar, of course.) The policy is not linked to AA, just a long-standing tradition.

As to lodges being somehow 'based' in, on or by Christian churches, I suspect you have been misinformed. The two are, with some specific and very limited examples, totally separate and independent.
Jul 06, 2016
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		things
by: Ebnä Hakim

Hello Lant,
***
2) What reputable source has shown that elements of Templar chivalry is present in current Masonic teaching?
***
I would say `there is expectation` according to the nine grades of the Scottish Rite ; and somehow a `safekeeping` to Christian Hermetism at least before Anderson and its falsifications.
***
But anyway, an interesting set of questions which are unfortunately not answered ; a preference in slandering and spreading falsehood in place of facts had become the `truth` these days ; the days of illusions and the `infinite` worshiping of the ego calling it `God`, how foolish ignorance is.
***
Cordially.
Jul 08, 2016
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		joningg freemason
by: Anonymous

i am from mombasa kenya and i realky like to join free mason please help the brother i have all the qualities required
Jul 08, 2016
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		Pardon?
by: Lant

@Ebnä Hakim

Thank you for your post, but I am a bit uncertain as to how to respond.

I am unaware of the nine 'grades' in the Scottish Rite you are referring to, nor to I understand the 'expectations' you mention. (I am not Scottish Rite and hence may have missed something SR members are aware of. One obviously cannot of course really understand something without experiencing it.)

I have read Anderson and Masonic history of the time, but am not sure which 'falsifications' you refer to. As to Christian Hermeticism, I am again hardly an expert on such an arcane subject, but while my readings show some parallels, it would be easy to overstate any tenuous links between them.

As to your last paragraph, I must confess that I just don't understand what you are saying. Perhaps you could expand a bit.

Looking forward to hearing from you.
Jul 08, 2016
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		Mombassa inquiry
by: Lant

Thank you for your question.

You need to contact the District Grand Lodge of East Africa. http://www.dgleastafrica.org
Jul 08, 2016
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		following up
by: Ebnä Hakim

Hello Rant,
***
I would say the first is related to Anderson and Desaguliers are known for destructing Masonic documents and manuscripts to cover up some of their innovations and to hide the link to catholic roman rites (( context, how it could not be? even historically and geographically speaking? )) ;
***
some expressions like "Fidelity to God", "to the Holy Church and the King", the King in this matter being Christ, not as a `man` but as a `prototype of perfection` and the Church surely the Celestial One.
***
To see:
-- The Sacrament of Holy Orders.
-- The secret Grand Mastership of the Masons was hereditary in the house of Stuart.
***
My last paragraph is about what I could read in this thread: opposing an exoteric Law ; its applications and individual obligations towards it (and some strange understandings of it);
***
to the domain of esoteric teachings : both are related by their common Principle, but their natures are different, there are the two expressions of the same supra-reality [beyond the forms and manifestations], [[ also some confusions: if we say `esoterism` it implies `exoterism` ]]
***
but their domain of application and nature cannot be mixed. People following strictly a Law as an exoteric corpus should not comment about a domain they have no mandate of it or knowledge, it will avoid them to say silly things and spreading falsehood (using `God`'s name as a proof...) .
***
Cordially.
Jul 08, 2016
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		Mombassa inquiry
by: Lant

Thank you for your question.

You need to contact the District Grand Lodge of East Africa. http://www.dgleastafrica.org
Jul 08, 2016
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		???
by: Lant

I'm very sorry, but I haven't a clue what you are getting at.


Jul 24, 2016
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		can amuslim be a Free mason
by: Monteiro lobato

We, freemasons ought not to convince somebody to enter to the Craft.
We put our cards on the table; if they have any doubt they have to consult their own mind, with their religious authorities.
It is not convinient for our Craft and our minds to argue in that subject.
Let it be!
Regards
Jul 27, 2016
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		Hardly
by: Lant

This forum is a place to discuss Freemasonry, not to spread bias, prejudice and hatred.
Aug 15, 2016
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		Conflict
by: Mason and Christian

I find a conflict na Muslim being a mason. As a Christian I am taught to love all people. And I see where I Muslims worldwide are killing Christians because they don't believe in there God. How can a Muslim Mia Mason when he can't love somebody who believes in God not Allah. I just find that a conflict against what Masonry teaches us.
Aug 16, 2016
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		Not so simple
by: Lant

Yes, there are Muslims killing Christians. There are also Muslims killing Christians and Muslims killing Muslims and Christians killing Muslims. In context, your argument fails.

As well, you are talking about huge groups; Freemasonry deals with individuals. I am proud to have a number of Muslim brethren who are far more representative of their faith than ISIS or Al Qaeda
Aug 16, 2016
Rating
star 		freemason
by: Anonymous

don't join freemason my brothers they want to defeat the world and islam
what you get when you be in freemason?
why you be it?
they teach you how to defeat the world and islam
don't join it
they are behind all things like isis
Aug 16, 2016
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		Nomsense
by: Thane

And your evidence for such a silly claim is what?

Aug 28, 2016
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		Can a Pantheist become a mason
by: Anonymous

My views are Pantheist, ie god or the great universal architect creator is in everything everywhere. I believe an afterlife, but do not follow any formal religion. I understand how the occult works, but disapprove of its use, when becoming a mason what are the deities one is expected to submit too.
Aug 28, 2016
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		Re Pantheism
by: Tharn

There is no bar to pantheist membership, although monotheism is essential in some areas. As to being expected to submit to a special deity or deities, no. Freemasonry is not a religion and has no specific deity. Members are encouraged to follow their own faiths.
Aug 31, 2016
Rating
star 		do not join the cult
by: Anonymous

damn y'all, the wool is pulled tightly over your eyes.

Freemasonry is NOT about brotherhood, especially world wide. Indeed, it's quite the opposite. This cult prides themselves on being the invisible architects of society. Freemasonry and Judaism are rooted in the same agenda - ordo ab chao, order out of chaos.

The people on here I'm sure are by and large well intentioned and good natured. That's a shame, your compassion is being wasted and used by the controllers of your lodges and higher power structures. Even now, as I type this, the Masonic number of obsession is coded right into the word below you type to ensure you're not a bot - lumbar. there are 33 vertebrae in the spinal column.
Aug 31, 2016
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		Snicker
by: Jack

Honestly, do you people stay up late at night practising this silliness?

The same stale, unsubstantiated, antiSemitic paranoid moans about world domination and secret controllers. Over and over and over, as if endless repetition will somehow make it all true. Such a sad way to spend a pointless life.


Sep 05, 2016
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		It is mainly baptisit that are greedy enough to join
by: jamesmcdaniel1605shardymillrdlexingtonindiana

The Masons or based on the ancient mysteries, which is no mystery. When the Israelites left Egypt and Moses went to receive the ten commandments from ALLAH, the Israelites became free masons by worshiping Moloch the big golden bull, and various other demons and Satan. The star of female freemasonry (eastern star) is the Star of Set, (eastern star) The star of set is the oldest form of Satanism, that makes one of there stars the Satanic star and the other one the star of Moloch, look do your research before selling your soul to demons and Satan. King Solomon had 700 wives and 300 concubines his wives lead him away from Allah to worship other gods like Moloch one of there symbols is the all seeing eye of Moloch. There is a war in heaven and on earth for the souls of mankind, pick a side. Mohammad the last messenger of Allah saw that Christians and Jews had turned towards the worship of other Gods like the golden calf Moloch.
Sep 12, 2016
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		Snicker again
by: Jack

Friend, one could only hope that your faith is stronger than the childish foolishness you have allowed yourself to be sold. Your ignorance of the nature of Freemasonry is simply amazing.

May the Almighty bring peace to you.
Sep 13, 2016
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		Beliefs
by: Eric

The book has been finished already!
God won!
It doent matter what sinful man thinks
Men all of them are all created by God
God needs no building or religion
Forget what everyone tells you
Go pray to God men like to prove things
Waste of time God sees the heart and soul
Sep 17, 2016
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		SHEEP
by: LEARN

My ppl perish for lack of knowledge. We kill what we don't know or understand. When are we going to stop fighting over the crumbs of ignorance and hearsay that we seem to continually bring up over and over thru out history? When are we going to start acting like the brothers and sisters that we all are? The same blood that runs thru you runs thru me. Strip down our skin and hair, we are all the same. The Creator of all of US, to me would look down and ask why do you persecute each other that's not why I created you.
If you truley wanted to know the truth then you would actually do the research to find the TRUTH not someone's gossip. Back up what you say with the Truth. And the plain truth is until we mature enough to say to ourselves I will not persecute my brother, be it any faith or organization that my brother is part of we will always fall short of being what our Creator expects us to be.
Sheep led to disagree and quarrel over whose right. What do you gain? NOTHING AND LOOSING THE CHANCE TO LEARN MORE ABOUT YOUR BROTHER!!! Only do I know whats right for me. LEARN the truth the information is out there.
Sep 18, 2016
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		???
by: Thane

Eroc, Learn - what does anything you are talking about have to do with Masonry? This is a site about Freemasonry.
Nov 08, 2016
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		shirk is the sin of practicing idolatry or polytheism
by: Anonymous

being a part of the masonic order is not contrary to Islam, the masonic order is from prophet Solomon. Any Muslim that doesn't know this, voids understand integral details of the history of his own religion. It is not Shirk, only if you are demented Wahhabi or influenced by them that you would think you could only get knowledge from books written by abdul ibin wahhab. Of course you can learn from writings from all over the world let it not influence your faith in the one god or the last day.
Dec 08, 2016
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		Open to ALL good men
by: Anonymous

There is nothing in Freemasonry that will conflict with your political, rerelical or moral obligations.
Jan 14, 2017
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		The Truth
by: 1000 years

Freemasonry is a great organization in it's foundation. Unfortunately, it's become completely corrupted here in the states. If you were to join Freemasonry, you should do it in the UK or Britain or elsewhere..anywhere but America, France or Spain.

Islam is a better discipline for us muslims.. because it's engrained into our minds isnce young.. Meaning that even high level programming and brainwashn cannot break our morals and instincts of being muslim. It's why our religion has so muhc memorization and reptition.

Freemasonry also has alot of memorization and repetition.. But Islam existed way before Freemasonry.. Islam was formulated at one point and the Koran was revealed at one point but the traditions predate Babylonian times.

Freemasonry incorporates mathematics and geometry as well.. But ISlam did it first. Islam is more scientific in nature than Freemasonry as it follows real planetary cycles and many scientific discoveries have been founded in the Koran far before modern science discovered them.

Unlike Freemasonry, Islam is clear as to what life is, what our purpose is and denotes everything you need to know. islam teaches about the unseeen beings (djinn), warns of black magick, and all type of other ills..

Most freemasons have no idea what Freemasonry is about. I dare you to go and ask 10 freemasons what it is about .. they will all give you a different answer.. and none will be clear.

In my opinion Freemasonry was ag ood thing that is now used to take smart thinkers and people seeking wisdom and who are aware of political agendas on a large scale and have a high conscious level, and it indoctrinates them and keeps them labeled and controlled through devastating oaths and more. A former freemason told me blackmail is very prevelant in the circles.. I do not believe nor shun him completely.. But it is what I was told.

Islam has everything we need.. Surahs that regulate the chakras and balances them, which corrrespond with glands in our body and organs, keeping us healthy and full of vitality. Our prayers raises kundalini energy, brightens our auras to prevent djinns and black magick from afflicting us.. Our positions and recitations stimulate parts of the brain that are used for decision making, morality, logic, increased cognition, etc..

When I was very religious in Islam.. I would meet masons by random while being interested in Masonry.. and they would almost seem afraid of me, or obedient to me.. As If I was someone of prominence withint heir own organization ros mething.. and I didnt realize why.. It was odd.. MAny thought I was a mason myself.. which I wasnt..

At the time I was very religious and praying all my prayers and reading koran regularly..

Shows you the power of Islam..

Also. I do want to mention, make sure you judge freemasons by their character.. Meet some first. The ones I've met were all people I would not respect by any means.. I won't even say why.. but their actions and the way they lived was not good.

I know a worshipful master in one lodge who holds many degrees.. The guy pays prostitutes for sex and drinks tremendously..

Freemasonry is truly corrupted these days..

Jan 31, 2017
Rating
star 		VERY SAD LOGIC
by: tHANE

PARDON THE APPARENT SHOUTING, BUT CAPITALS SEEM TO BE THE BEST WAY TO DISTINGUISH YOUR CLAIMS FROM MY RESPONSE.

Freemasonry is a great organization in it's foundation. Unfortunately, it's become completely corrupted here in the states. If you were to join Freemasonry, you should do it in the UK or Britain or elsewhere..anywhere but America, France or Spain. INTERESTING THAT YOU WOULD MENTION THOSE SPECIFIC COUNTRIES. HAVE YOU STUDIED MASONRY IN EACH OF THEM? FRANKLY, IT'S HARD TO SEE WHAT YOU ARE BASING YOUR STATEMENT ON.

Islam is a better discipline for us muslims.. because it's engrained into our minds isnce young.. Meaning that even high level programming and brainwashn cannot break our morals and instincts of being muslim. It's why our religion has so muhc memorization and reptition.

Freemasonry also has alot of memorization and repetition.. But Islam existed way before Freemasonry.. SO?

Islam was formulated at one point and the Koran was revealed at one point but the traditions predate Babylonian times.

Freemasonry incorporates mathematics and geometry as well.. But Islam did it first. Islam is more scientific in nature than Freemasonry as it follows real planetary cycles and many scientific discoveries have been founded in the Koran far before modern science discovered them. HAVING READ THE KORAN SEVERAL TIMES, I AM A BIT FUZZY ON WHICH MAJOR SCIENTIFIC DISCOVERIES ARE CONTAINED IN IT. PERHAPS YOU COULD HELP ME OUT AND GIVE SOME EXAMPLES, WITH REFERENCES TO SPECIFIC SURAHS.

Unlike Freemasonry, Islam is clear as to what life is, what our purpose is and denotes everything you need to know. islam teaches about the unseeen beings (djinn), warns of black magick, and all type of other ills.. YOUR CLAIM THAT ISLAM IS SCIENTIFIC IN NATURE IS DOUBLY CURIOUS SINCE YOU THEN START TALKING ABOUT CHAKRAS AND AURAS AND HOW ISLAM DEFENDS YOU AGAINST DJINNS AND BLACK MAGICK [sic]...

Most freemasons have no idea what Freemasonry is about. I dare you to go and ask 10 freemasons what it is about .. they will all give you a different answer.. and none will be clear. FOR ONE WHO ACTUALLY UNDERSTANDS FREEMASONRY, THE ANSWERS ARE CLEAR, JUST NOT THE SAME. MASONRY OFFERS MANY THINGS TO MANY DIFFERENT PEOPLE. SOME ARE MORE INTERESTED IN ITS PHILOSOPHY, SOME IN ITS HISTORY, SOME IN ITS CHARITABLE ASPECTS AND SO FORTH. NONE ARE WRONG. THAT YOU FIND THIS PUZZLING ONLY SPEAKS TO YOUR LACK OF RESEARCH AND UNDERSTANDING.

In my opinion Freemasonry was ag ood thing that is now used to take smart thinkers and people seeking wisdom and who are aware of political agendas on a large scale and have a high conscious level, and it indoctrinates them and keeps them labeled and controlled through devastating oaths and more. OF COURSE, ANOTHER CONSPIRACY THEORY.

A former freemason told me blackmail is very prevelant in the circles.. I do not believe nor shun him completely.. But it is what I was told. YOU DIDN'T BELIEVE HIM, BUT YOU ARE CITING HIM IN AN ARGUMENT. CURIOUS. IN ALL MY YEARS AS A MASON, I'VE NEVER SEEN OR HEARD OF BLACKMAIL IN LODGE. NO DOUBT I HAVE JUST BEEN LUCKY OR SOMETHING.

Islam has everything we need.. Surahs that regulate the chakras and balances them, which corrrespond with glands in our body and organs, keeping us healthy and full of vitality. Our prayers raises kundalini energy, brightens our auras to prevent djinns and black magick from afflicting us.. Our positions and recitations stimulate parts of the brain that are used for decision making, morality, logic, increased cognition, etc..

When I was very religious in Islam.. I would meet masons by random while being interested in Masonry.. and they would almost seem afraid of me, or obedient to me.. As If I was someone of prominence withint heir own organization ros mething.. and I didnt realize why.. It was odd.. MAny thought I was a mason myself.. which I wasnt.. ODD. I HAVE MET MANY MUSLIMS AND AM GOOD FRIENDS WITH A NUMBER OF THEM. I CANNOT EVER THINK OF BEING AFRAID OF ANY OF THEM. SEVERAL MUSLIMS IN MY CITY SPONSOR AN ANNUAL EID DINNER FOR CHARITY. I HAVEN'T SEEN ANY OF THE MANY MASONS WHO ARE PLEASED TO ATTEND AFRAID OF OR OBEDIENT TO ANYBODY THERE. HOW VERY SILLY.

Also. I do want to mention, make sure you judge freemasons by their character.. Meet some first. The ones I've met were all people I would not respect by any means.. I won't even say why.. but their actions and the way they lived was not good. ONE COULD, OF COURSE, SAY PRECISELY THE SAME THING ABOUT MUSLIMS – A WISE MAN, A GOOD MAN, WOULD JUDGE THEM INDIVIDUALLY ON THEIR INDIVIDUAL CHARACTERS. I MYSELF KNOW QUITE A FEW MUSLIMS. SOME ARE GOOD MEN, SOME ARE NOT. DO THE BAD ONES PROVE THAT ISLAM IS WRONG OR BAD? HARDLY - YOUR LOGIC FAILS.

I know a worshipful master in one lodge who holds many degrees.. The guy pays prostitutes for sex and drinks tremendously.. AND NO MUSLIM HAS EVER DONE SO? JUDGING A GROUP BY ITS WORST, AS OPPOSED TO ITS BEST, ONLY WORKS IF YOU ARE PREPARED TO ACCEPT THE SAME THING IN RETURN. I MYSELF WOULD HESITATE TO JUDGE THE RELIGION OF PEACE BY THE ACTIONS OF, SAY, MEMBERS OF ISIS.

Freemasonry is truly corrupted these days.. SNICKER.
Feb 02, 2017
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		supreme being
by: Anonymous

Please can you explain to me what you mean by you have to believe in supreme being?I dont believe in anything apart from the one and only creator Allah swt.Can i still be a mason without beliving in a supreme being?


Feb 03, 2017
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		Certainly
by: Lant

As a Muslim, do you not believe that Allah is the Supreme Being? If you believe that, then there is no issue.

There is no Masonic deity. All that we ask is that a prospective member believe, in his own faith. We do not even ask him to define his belief, for that is a matter which must remain between the Almighty and the individual man.

Nor do we make any attempt to convert any man away from his own faith. We do say short prayers together, but with each praying in his own faith. Discussion of religion is otherwise forbidden in lodge, lest it offend anyone.

I hope that answers your question.

Peace to you, my friend.
Feb 11, 2017
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		History of Islam in America
by: Masonic Historical Records?

Hello,
I am a Muslim woman born to a Muslim middle eastern father and a convert white mother, and a practicing Muslim. In researching my mother's genealogy, we found that she has a dutch gx9 grandfather who converted to Islam in the 1600's, and that he founded a whole country in current day Morocco for European pirate crews to settle in called Salle. In doing more research, I found that several Europeans converted to Islam at that time, but that many of them were pirates. The character, Jack Sparrow from the movie Pirates of the Carribean is based on one such pirate.

Through researching my mother's ancestry, I have come to theorize that several retired Muslim convert European and Turk pirates came to live in America and found refuge in Masonic lodges. (Research Turks of South Carolina - Moor Sundry Act of 1790). I also believe that retired pirates also may have assisted George Washington in the continental army, and may have had a strong influence on George Washington. (I find it interesting that George Washington avoided taking communion). If any evidence could give proof to this theory, the evidence would be validating for Muslim youth who are led to believe that to be Muslim makes them less of an American and that America was founded on Christian values.

I think that some of this proof could come from my own ancestors. The dutch convert I spoke of, Jan Jansoon, sent his son, Antony Van Salle, to live in New Amsterdam. Antony Van Salle became the first settler of Brooklyn. A Qur'an was known to have been passed down from him to about 5 generations when it was lost. Gravestones of Thomas Spragg and Edward Spragg, 4 and 6 generations down have symbols that could be Muslim symbols. One looks like a Kabba, and other is the one finger pointing up, which Amir Muhammad, curator of the America's Islamic Heritage Museum, proposes is a Muslim American symbol. Several others are buried in Masonic graveyards. My grandfather, himself, told my mother before he died, that he believed in one God, but that he did not really see himself as a Christian.

How can I find out about my ancestor's involvement in Masonic Lodges from colonial times? Thank you for your help.

Feb 11, 2017
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		Most interesting
by: Lant

Thank you for your question, ma'am. A most interesting concept.

Without any disrespect to yourself or to the religion of the Prophet (the immediate past master of my lodge and my very good friend is a Muslim), North America as a whole was initially colonized and settled by Europeans. The Eastern United States was settled almost entirely by Northern Europeans, primarily English, but with some Dutch, Danish, etc colonies as well.

Given the demographics of the time, the overwhelming majority of settlers would have been Protestant Christians. There are records of non-Christians, of course, but relatively few in the early days. Again, virtually every early settler would have been Christian.

There is, I gather, some evidence that Arab explorers may have arrived in the Americas pre-Columbus. There is also good reason to believe that some of the black slaves imported into the Americas were Muslim. What I have not been able to find is any solid evidence showing a noticeable Muslim presence in the United States much prior to the 1900s.

Certain it is that it would be very, very hard to find a known Muslim in the early (pre-1800) government(s) in the Eastern states.

In short, I fear that the USA was indeed founded on Christian principles, if only because the overwhelming majority of the men who founded it were themselves Christians.

From my own point of view, that is a matter of old history; interesting, but not having a major bearing on your children today. Our society is among the most diverse in the world and both men and women of all races, all religions, have a voice, have equal rights. My city has a Muslim mayor, a black man was just President and a woman just narrowly failed to become President. Without straying into politics (for such we are not to do), I find the thought that a person's religion could affect their loyalty to their country silly. One thing I will tell you about Masons - we believe that a man should be judged by his character, not his religion, race or wealth.

I guess what I am trying to say is that while we should know and understand our history, it is even more important for each of us to know our society today. My ancestors had no place in founding my country either; that doesn't particularly bother me for I am proud of them and proud of their legacy of courage and hard work. Our society changes and evolves and it is up to each of us to help that process along, to leave our nation and our people better off through our efforts.

The term 'pirate' is rather a loaded one. Morality changes with time and one person's pirate is another's naval hero. Today's English look back with fondness on Sir Francis Drake, yet the Spanish certainly considered him a pirate and (in common with most sailors of his day) he was also a slave trader. For every Henry Morgan, there is a Dragut, for every Reis, a Lafitte.

And it should not be forgotten is that the first war between the USA and Muslims was on account of North African piracy. Nor should we overlook widespread Muslim slaver raids as far away as Iceland, Ireland and England, well into the 1600s. So piracy was a serious problem around the world, with every nation having its own.

Did some Christian sailors convert to Islam? Absolutely! There is solid historical evidence for that, but it does seem to have been limited to those serving in or at least located in Muslim areas. There's little evidence however of them moving to other countries and maintaining their new faith after moving. Maybe, but little evidence.

Again, thank you for your question. I do intend to spend some time researching this; if I find something that contradicts what I have said above, I promise to post it. I regret your ancestral Koran has been lost, for it would have been such prize for your family.

In the meantime, although I suspect records that far back would be spotty at best, you could try the grand lodges of the states in question, all of which habe internet sites. Good luck and I do hope you share anything you find.

Peace to you and yours.
Feb 14, 2017
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		Islam in America
by: Islam in America

Thank you for your response. I would like to respond to some of the comments that were made.

First, I never argued that the majority of people who settled in American were Europeans and Protestants. That is obvious. What I am arguing is that that is the broad generalization of the majority, and not reflecting the reality of the existence of a minority. This minority included Muslims. Some of them could have been Europeans who converted to Islam. Maybe they did not accept Islam in ritual, but they could have accepted Islam in principle. After all, Muslims define ourselves only as a person who believes in One God and believes that Muhammad is a Messenger of God. Muslims also believe in salvation through works. These are ideas that Masons accept.

Proof that there was a Muslim minority also lies in the documentation of the Turks of Sumter Co. as documented by the Moor Sundry Act of 1790. Not to mention all of the hundreds of slaves who built this country, many of whom were Muslim and DID in fact maintain their religion for in America as slaves (Bilali of Sapelo Island is a good example). Again, I'm not saying these cases were completely common. Instead, I'm saying that they existed and were more common that we report in our history books when we teach children.

Next, to say America was founded on Christian values is not a complete truth. It was founded on Masonic values. I really do not think that Masonic and Christian values are the same. Christians believe that salvation is through Christ alone. Masons won't even say "Christ. " They say "God." George Washington refused to take communion and was reprimanded by his pastor for not taking communion. George Washington and the founding fathers considered Muslims when they founded our country, even though they were enemies of the time. Benjamin Franklin defended Muslims. America was founded on religious freedom instilled by Masonic principles.

Finally, heritage is not silly. It teaches people about each other. Several minority groups have heritage weeks or months. I'm not the one who needs to see Muslims in my American heritage in order to feel more loyal to my country. I know I am proud to be an American. I know where my loyalty lies. I don't need anything to convince me of that. It's everyone else who questions the loyalty of Muslims simply because they are Muslim who need to learn from Islamic American Heritage. That's why this history is important to research.

Thank you for your expressed interest in the topic. You can read more on my blog: www.nazziepaterrov.wordpress.com.
Feb 15, 2017
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		Balance
by: Lant

I am not sure where I denied the existence of Islam in the British colonies, later the USA. That there were Muslims there is a certainty. However, even today, after several major immigration booms in the past century, Muslims still make up less than 1% of the US population. Back in the day, it would have been a small fraction of that, a relatively tiny number.

That does not – not – mean that those individuals and small communities were bad people, bad citizens or anything. It is simply a statement of fact. While there were some Muslims there, there were simply not many of them.

The Moor Sundry Act which you refer to is, if one looks at it carefully, clear evidence of the very low social status of the individuals in question. Sadly, there were in some places effectively two systems of justice, one for blacks and one for whites. The four men who filed the petition wanted their status clarified so that they would, if charged with an offense, be treated more leniently. Had the community in question had any kind of social, economic or political influence, they would not have had to ask for that clarification. Happily, things have changed.

Further, I fear that you have some basic misunderstandings about Freemasonry. Many Masons say, "Jesus," for instance. The key thing is that they do not say it in a lodge meeting. And, while some individual Masons may agree that Mohamed was the Messenger of God, not all Masons would and Freemasonry as a body takes absolutely no stand on that. Nor it does speak of salvation at all. Freemasonry is not a religion.

The claim George Washington attended church rarely and never took communion is pretty thin evidence for anything. First off, such claims are challenged by many historians. There are records of him attending many times and people of his time recorded taking communion with him. He served on church committees and supported them financially. The most that can be said with any degree of reality is that his participation in church services was spotty – and that was common enough at the time. (I would venture to say that you will find men and women who consider themselves Muslim who do not pray the mandatory five times a day or fast completely during daylight in Ramadan. The absence of perfect adherence indicates nothing, sorry.)

The place of religion in the new republic is complicated and the separation of church and state in the new republic was not entirely philosophical. The Church of England was the official and mandated religion in England, with the King being head of the church and bishops being appointed from afar. Catholics were not entitled to a vote until the 1800s and it was illegal for some sects to hold services. In a society formed primarily of a broad mix of Christian sects (remember for instance *why* the Puritans came to New England), such entanglement of church and state was an irritant, one the founders of the new country specifically barred. The nation was founded to be considerate of *all* religions, to ensure that no religion would take over. That leaning to a freedom of religion certainly parallels Masonry's openness, but it hardly proves a connection.

It is significant that many laws supporting Christianity remained on the books and were created after the revolution. Laws forbade blasphemy (interpreted at the time as against the Christian faith) and banned a host of other activities on Sunday – some sporting activities, sales of alcohol, specific types of business or business in general, etc. It is clear that, despite the formal separation of church and state, Christianity had enormous influence on early US society. That too has changed and is changing.

As for Franklin defending Muslims, I can only state that I (a Christian) have defended Muslims, too. What does this prove? In your case, it merely proves that Ben Franklin was a good man.

Lastly, please show me where I said that heritage is 'silly'. If we are to have a discussion, I think it would be best if we stuck to what has actually happened, things actually said.

In short, ma'am, I fully agree that one can find good, solid evidence of there having been Muslims in what is now the USA many years ago. No argument. History records some of them as interesting individuals – skilled, brave, etc. No argument. My only point is that being able to point out a few individuals is hardly evidence of significant influence, eg your proposition that Christian pirates converted to Islam, then moved to the USA, found refuge in Masonic lodges and strongly influenced George Washington – all your words. A few Muslim individuals here and there simply does not support that claim.

Heritage is a good thing and one should always remember our history. But that history should be accurate and balanced. And, as I said, of more importance than where we came from is where we are going to.

Peace to you, ma'am.
Feb 15, 2017
Rating
starstarstarstar 		Spectator Commentary
by: ****

First off, AsSalaamAlaykume everybody. This comment is for the people on the outside, if if's too political then feel free to take it down because I know you dudes don't like answering political questions so that's cool. No hard feelings, aye? I'd also like to metion I might not know what I'm talking about and I've already made myself at peace with that possible possibility.

Let's look at some alleged conspiracy theories in a hypothetical, "historical fiction" context, like it was a live play. I suggest this because the people at the center of attention here say it works for them. So these dudes don't get offended, the antagonistic faction doesn't have to be one of them, it could be any real or hypothetical organisation.

One of many allegories for this situation would be a rivalry between a pack of wolves against a various scattered songbirds. Although meek prey, the songbirds have a beautiful and nobel way of life which no amount brute power, numbers, or strategems can reach in virtue. You might argue that the songbirds, in prosperous conditions, would have more unity in their community. It's my observation that knights of the east and the west both moved their heads the way birds do when clad in armour. The society and hierarchy of the wolves is unpleasant and I'd prefer to live in the nation of the birds myself. The chivalry of the birds is, in my eyes, the right one for me to be inspired by.

That brings us to the general character in question concerning the antagonists, we have a general idea of our protagonists already. Like mentioned earlier the Masons don't necessarily have to be the bad guys in the terms and scope of the situation. The first thing to consider right now, the most important thing worth protecting after belief in this case would also be the vital thread that holds an upright humanity together. I mention this because someone or some organisation seems to be determined to attack it on all fronts. If you know what I'm talking about than good for you, I won't say it here however because anything on the Internet can be manipulated and changed, therefore as a knight in my own right, I spare some words to keep it vague. We notice that much the root of our cries in the wilderness is suffering from a worldwide persecution that is advanced and methodical is it's distribution, especially towards Muslims and the other established castes The Empire has created in the "third" world, as the saying goes, "as above, so below" this pyramid of social structure is reflected in all levels of society and government. It is unpleasant to imagine environment of those trapped a the bottom. In India you would know of a caste called the "untouchables", you can guess why. However in the English language their are ironies and also malevolent tricks placed therein to deprave communication. It's easy to notice them if you know what to look for. The Untouchables are in my perception and irony because I associate "untouchableness" with nimble birds, I think it's an honour title. Back to the hypothetical realm. This enemy of mankind is rumoured to be dark sorcerers, secret kings, shrewd merchants, bankers of usury, genocidal warlords, gang stalkers, corrupt officials,and political actors and all other criminal and immoral professions united in rebellion against everything a righteous soul loves. Some say they can manufacturer depravity and suffering where they wish, often like a dark feng shui. Many of us have heard about the heartless barbarians but most of us can't agree on who they are in the world. Most of us know about the dangers of dark contracts. It seems as if an ever evolving number of tactics have been employed to hinder and destroy the use of companies and international trade in the Middle East for those who wish to use it to bring their neighbors together and rise up against those who have dedicated an industrious manner of oppression to bring down the people when they try to stand up for themselves. We are talking about mischief masters who have ambitions that challenge their own maker. Sad, and foolish, 0%c chance for their success. These minions wish to destroy Islam and all Muslims (aside from traitors). The Muslims are like a family of songbirds with broken wings surrounded by wolves. The Empire encompasses the whole world and all nations and governments and vassal subjects of The Empire are puppet regimes designed to enforcement the payment of an infinite, unlawful debt you never agreed to owe. Their weapons of war and suppression are sinister looking, designed to look as menacing as possible while causing destruction the most "horror movie" carnage they can so they can keep you afraid of them instead of your maker. Logistically, we appear powerless and without defense against the physical manifestations of hate used against us, however logistics would only scare a coward when dealing with matters like this. Pray for the best and prepare for the worst. Someone who thinks that another Spanish Inquisition could never happen in our modern, forgiving, civilized secular society should at least entertain the possibility in a "Samurai" like meditation and visualize a way to endure and defeat the enemy in the most gentleman like way possible.

So, if you suspect these antagonists of empathy to be possessed, literally or metaphorically, then perhaps we good people should approach our conquering of this unfortunate system in a way like ruqiya/exorcism and try to save as many of our enemies as possible and foil the plots of the stubborn. If we could do that it would be an insult to the devil and we would increase our ranks, if our mission is good than most people would be happy to help, but only with security and caution. They hide from us the history of Muslims and Christians united in solidarity against this wicked enemy. As god-like as they would make themselves out to be, we good people had them cornered not too long ago. We need to understand that the utopianism they long for doesn't include us. We are the worthless and expendable means to their ends, scheduled to be consumed by the system in their minds. For us Earth is the moral realm and it's health and well being a sign of thec ollective morality of all. A paradise nation on Earth is impossible, but it's noble to try to get as close to such a thing as you're allowed to and meant to . So if you have a problem with the crimes you believe are perpetrated by secret societies, we have friends and family, and like minded people all around us and according to The Empire, we have a right to make our own societies right? Brothers, if you are interested in joining an organisation, why not join one you're confident about. If you're tired of these elitists having power over you in affairs simply because they belong to an inclusive, self serving group, use friendship with your trusted equals and establish your own charitable societies, trading companies, and rescue teams. Our enemies might tremble if such organisations rose up everywhere, recruited from the bottom of The Empire's rejected castes. Not only should the poor rise up and set a higher standard but with our greater numbers, we can reach out to people far more than they can, let's compete against them in every way needed. It's something we have to overcome when up against a philosophy that puts amonetrary price on all life and foolishly believes that people must be held back from their true potential in order to maintain "balance" and "power" for their civilization." Do unto others what you would have done unto you" a great rule indeed. Why not do unto others what your mother would do unto you too? For Motherly Love is stronger fatherly authority and I trust my mother to be of higher morals than myself. We are aware of a secret counsel that was founded specifically to turn us away from Allah(SWT). They forbid the participation of women. Is this perhaps because most women who have ever held a child in their arms would be too shocked and opposed to the cruelty to participate? Allah(SWT) knows best.

Feb 15, 2017
Rating
starstarstar 		Spectator Commentary
by: ****


And that about wraps up my hypothetical situation. Again, not calling the Mason's the bad guys, I stress that this antagonist is hypothetical, just wondering what you guys think. When it comes to conspiracy and cause for concern regarding the secret sects, I think that's a good fictional representation of what many of us are worried right now. Because of the political themes, I understand you'd rather avoid these discussions. I have a few questions to ask these letter G fellows now though.

1. If Masonry is not opposed Islam, than why does the collectable edition of the Masonry Bible have a preface section that glorifies the enemies of Islamic Civilization and refers to us as "barbarians"?
2. If you're cause is as just as you say it is, and you're knowledge and expertise unmatched , than tell us what organisation we should be protecting people from if it's not yours.
3. Since you have knowledge of the inner political workings of the world, you might know whether my guess is close or not. While not asking for political infomation because I get why you can't speak of it, can you at least tell us if the similar schemes were ever known historically but are not very related to today's tines?

Thanks to everyone who feels the need to weigh in. Don't take what I say too seriously, I'm just a vulgar idiot. I should mention now that when brothers and sisters comment here, we need to remember we are conversing with people who's social status and education would take us lifetimes to afford. We are the peasants and serfs speaking to the lords and barons. Keeping in mind the fact that many who have commented here don't speak English as a first language, we still ought to present ourselves in the best way possible and choose our words carefully like they do. I assume many Masons did well in English and Social Studies when they were in high school, important subjects for us to be well familiar with. I do not despise Masonry simply because I know many of them are nerds and most nerds are my friends. I own several 19th and 20th century non fiction books written by Masons and the wording is superb. I just find making swears of allegiance to an organisation in the name of God rather than an honourable promise between brothers to be disrespectful and many of the symbols give me a "they're spooky" feeling in my gut. Since we can't for sure tell if the Masons have our best interests at heart, and because we have many reasons to be suspicious of them, we should stick to bonding with our own religion and when you can't in your region bonding openly with Christians of good repute is a better option than trusting people who may want to hurt you.
WaAlaykumeAsSalaam


Sincerely ,
****
Feb 16, 2017
Rating
star 		Another conspiracy theory...
by: Thane

"The Empire", "birds", "wolves"... To be fair, your conspiracy theory is rather more colorful than most, but it's still at its heart a conspiracy theory – an unlikely and unproven accusation of a massive, undercover, all-powerful cabal designed to subjugate humanity. Wow.

To answer your specific questions, however:

1. "If Masonry is not opposed Islam, than why does the collectable edition of the Masonry Bible have a preface section that glorifies the enemies of Islamic Civilization and refers to us as 'barbarians'?"

Oddly on going through the Bible my lodge gives to Christian brothers on their initiation (Muslim brothers are given a Koran, Jewish ones a Torah, etc), I find no reference to Muslims as 'barbarians'.

There is a section talking about a concordant body formed in the 1800s named after the Knights Templar. Again, no reference to 'barbarians', nothing about suppression of Islam, just a call to defend one's nation and behave honorably.


2. "If you're cause is as just as you say it is, and you're knowledge and expertise unmatched , than tell us what organisation we should be protecting people from if it's not yours. "

A philosopher would call that a 'loaded question'. A classic example of such is, "Have you stopped beating your wife yet?" Loaded questions are based on unjustified or unproven accusations or assumptions of guilt. To answer that question either Yes or No is an admission of having at some time beaten your wife – even if you have never done so.

So yours is a loaded question carrying three such assumptions. The first and second are that we are "knowledge unmatched" and "expertise unmatched", in other words, that we have immense knowledge and power. But no true Mason would ever claim those, for they are simply not true. The third assumption is that there actually *is* some vast, sinister organization from which people need to be protected.

So here is my answer to your question. First, we don't have what you say we have and second, your 'conspiracy' is a delusion.


3. "Since you have knowledge of the inner political workings of the world, you might know whether my guess is close or not. While not asking for political infomation because I get why you can't speak of it, can you at least tell us if the similar schemes were ever known historically but are not very related to today's tines?"

A second loaded question, this one based on the belief that Freemasons are at the centre of that vast, spooky conspiracy and would thus have knowledge of a bunch of other plots. To that, I must say that we just do not have "knowledge of the inner political workings of the world." I'd be happy to tell you if we did, but that is just a foolish belief.

As to your claim of being a peasant speaking to "lords and barons", I believe that we have rich men in my lodge. We also have some very poor men, men out of work or on a small fixed income. I recently did a study of our records and, for the past century, the most common occupation of my lodge's members has been a store clerk – a salesman. Hardly high status or power, sorry. This charge is just more evidence of your belief in a conspiracy.

And, yes, this is an English-language forum and some of the people posting here are using English as a second language. Yet Freemasonry is universal and one could no doubt find a forum in another language. If you come here, it's English. (And your English is pretty good, far better than my Arabic.) My point is that if you are worried about linguistic tricks, go to a site in your own language. We won't object.

And, no, Freemasonry was not formed to destroy Islam. Such a claim borders on paranoia.

Conspiracy theories, some of my readings suggest, are often caused by a kind of cognitive dissonance, the inability to process two sets of facts which seem to us to contradict each other. In your case, it would seem to be a case of: 1) there's lots of wealth and power in the world but 2) many Muslims and many Muslim countries are poor and powerless. The mind then leads to the conclusion that the only way for this to happen is for some sinister, hidden, malevolent force to be responsible. The many other factors, more plausible explanations are discarded in favour of a paper-thin conspiracy theory.

So, Mr ****, some very basic reality for you.

First, Freemasonry is not against Islam. Freemasonry recognizes Islam as a great religion; my lodge has a Koran on its altar during meetings, right beside the Bible that represents the faith of most of our members. My lodge has a number of Muslims belonging to is – good men, devout Muslims. Those who claim we hate Muslims are at best mistaken and at worst lying to you.

We welcome good men of all religions to our brotherhood.

Second, Freemasonry is a system of morality, a way for a man to improve his behaviour and morals. The effects are subtle, it takes a lot of time and effort and it doesn't work for all, but the effects can be profound. It also offers social interaction with like-minded men. It offers no power, no riches, no supreme knowledge. Those who claim so are deluded. Our members are ordinary men of every color, every religion, every nationality. The core requirements are that they believe in God (atheists and agnostics are not permitted to join) and are of good character.

Third, Freemasonry doesn't run the world. Sometimes we run picnics and BBQs... (On that thought, if we were so all-powerful, so determined to suppress the huddled masses, why would a Mason be hosting this public site, engaging in open debate with our opponents, instead of just crushing such media and carrying on with our goal of Ruling The World?)

Mr ****, for your own sake, listen to the voices of reason, logic and love, not those of hate, fear, intolerance and vengeance.

May you find peace.
Feb 16, 2017
Rating
starstarstar 		More questions
by: ****

AsSalaamAlaykume, thanks for responding. I have a few questions that are unrelated to a worldwide conspiracy.

1. Hypothetically, if a group of non Masons started an organisation in your city with the same purpose of making good men better men but without rituals or creepiness, and they trying to gather relief for victims of DEW targeting, as a Mason, would you feel offended and have the police shut them down?

2.Is British Freemasonry the most authentic Freemasonry.

3. After hearing some Manly P. Hall lectures, it leaves one to suspect that these secret societies participate in djinn summoning and vessel binding. Is that in any way true?

4.Do the Freemasons practice martial arts like smallsword fencing and English boxing in the lodges?

5.If a Mason was caught smoking hashish, would he be banned from Freemasonry?

Thanks in advance.
Feb 16, 2017
Rating
starstar 		Still
by: Thane

Q1. "Hypothetically, if a group of non Masons started an organisation in your city with the same purpose of making good men better men but without rituals or creepiness, and they trying to gather relief for victims of DEW targeting, as a Mason, would you feel offended and have the police shut them down?"

A1: First, I am not sure what 'DEW targeting' is. Googling it, I found a lot about soft drink marketing and a couple of crackpot sites talking about mind control. If it is the latter, sorry, but you are definitely not staying away from conspiracy theories.

Second, why on earth would we be offended? Anybody trying to improve the lives of others is to be congratulated. (I mean, assuming you could find real victims of this alleged conspiracy.) Anyway, go for it.

Third, your question shows quite clearly that you still think Freemasons have the power to order the police around - back again to that secret, all-powerful, world-ruling plot fantasy thing. The reality is that we don't have that power, so even if we wanted to, no.


Q2. "Is British Freemasonry the most authentic Freemasonry."

A2. Freemasonry originated in the UK and spread from there around the world. As Masonry spread, changes were made in certain details. Rather like cuisine, each region has some interesting differences. They all share the same central things however.

British Masonry is no more official or authentic than any other authentic Masonry. (There are of course fake Masons, but that's a different subject.)

The United Grand Lodge of England is afforded an informal first-among-equals status, but has no real power over Masonry anywhere else.


Q3. After hearing some Manly P. Hall lectures, it leaves one to suspect that these secret societies participate in djinn summoning and vessel binding. Is that in any way true?

A3. Which secret societies? Hall wrote about a lot of spiritual and esoteric stuff. He was a Mason, but came to the Craft long after most of his writing was done. In any case, no, Freemasonry does not summon djinns, spirits or demons of any kind at any time. As to 'vessel binding', never heard of it.


Q4. Do the Freemasons practice martial arts like smallsword fencing and English boxing in the lodges?

A4. No.


Q5. If a Mason was caught smoking hashish, would he be banned from Freemasonry?

A5. Freemasons are sworn to obey the laws of the land in which they live and can be thrown out of the fraternity if they commit serious crimes. Beyond that, I am not going to speculate on hypothetical generalities; each case is judged on its own merits.


Peace.
Feb 26, 2017
Rating
starstarstarstar 		Yes, But Don't Do It, if you are unsure
by: Kemal

Freemasonary is a secret organization, and if you don't know what it is about you are encouraged to join. It is about gaining dominance and power in the world, and to establish brotherhood. I think you already have your own brotherhood in Islam. So, why do you want to become a Freemason? Nevertheless, there are already Muslim organizations whose founders were Freemasons, most notably the Muslim Brotherhood. Many symbols and practices of the MB are masonic in origin. So, many Muslims are Freemason by trade. Receb Ergogan, the Turkish President is one of such Muslims.
Feb 27, 2017
Rating
starstarstarstar 		my correction
by: Kemal

P.S. Sorry I meant "...you are not encouraged to join."
Feb 27, 2017
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		Reasonable
by: Thane

Thank you, Kemal, for your comments.

I would agree with you that Freemasonry is about brotherhood, for all men should recognize that they have more in common than they have differences.

We are however hardly about 'dominance and power', although that is indeed a common misconception.

As to being 'secret', Masonic halls have big signs in front of them with our well-known square-and-compasses symbol on them. How secret is that? We are listed in telephone registries, give tours of our buildings. And this discussion is being held on a Masonic website. How many secret bodies host public discussions? We are in reality a society with a few - a very few - secrets.

Freemasonry is indeed traces its roots to a trade, that of stonemason, but it is not a trade itself. It is a philosophy, a way of looking at the world, one's fellow men and oneself. (Thank you, by the way, for not wasting everybody's time not repeating that old falsehood about it being a religion.)

As to not being encouraged to join unless you know what it is about, I can only say that no course of study can ever be fully clear until one has entered it and begun learning what it has to offer. Would I be wrong in saying that about the religion of the Prophet? Did you yourself fully appreciate it until you had studied it?

Freemasonry is of no threat to Islam or to individual Muslims. It is certainly not for everybody and I would be the last to claim that it is the only way for a man to make himself better.
It is however a way that works.

As to President Regogan being a Mason, you are about the first person I have heard make that claim. I don't think so.

Peace to you, sir.
Feb 27, 2017
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		To Kemal: Thank you for the Masonic misinformation
by: Tim

Hello Kemal,
and thank you for visiting Masonsmart.

I'm not being flippant regarding Masonic misinformation. It's posts like yours that give us an opportunity to better explain what Freemasonry is, and we do appreciate that opportunity.

Where to begin? First, Freemasonry is not a secret organization. Like every organization, we do have secrets. In the Masonic organization, these secrets primarily regard the modes of recognition. Freemasonry is not suited to everyone. These modes of recognition are necessary to enable us to recognize those who may pretend to be Masons for dishonorable reasons.

Freemasonry is not about dominance or power in the world. It is about continually striving to improve oneself. Freemasonry teaches freedom of thought, of speech, of will. This is why Freemasonry is banned in countries where these freedoms are not a cherished part of the fabric of the nation. The only power a Mason seeks is in the wisdom and ability to control his own desires and passions, for without this control a man may act overzealously or selfishly toward others.

As to the claim regarding the Muslim Brotherhood being founded by Freemasons I can find no credible evidence of this, although it is mentioned on several conspiracy Web sites. If you have credible evidence of it please share it with us.

Regarding Masonic symbols, Freemasonry does use symbols in its teachings and some symbols have come to be recognized as Masonic. However, the Masonic organization does not control the use of symbols. Symbols are not trademarked or copyrighted. Some organizations use symbols similar or even identical to those used by the Masonic fraternity. This does not make these organizations Masonic.

As to the claim that Recep Tayyip Erdoğan is a Freemason, again I find no credible evidence of this. However, I tend to doubt its accuracy as he is known to have authored, directed and played the lead role in the stage play Maskomya in which Freemasonry, among others, was presented as evil.

Again, thank you for visiting Masonsmart. I wish you peace and wellness.

Fraternally,

Tim
Mar 05, 2017
Rating
starstarstar 		Controlled Opposition
by: ****

We need to use discernment when researching the Freemasons. Just like there are a lot of non Masons pretending to be Masons for whatever reasons, there are a lot of Masons pretending to be opposed to Freemasonry. Harun Yahya is one of the red herrings, he is controlled opposition. The man wrote many books with a lot of truth and good information in them, but they always taint the truth. He wrote books about the global Freemasonry conspiracy, condemning it act acting like one of us. With the large number of people he was reaching, and the nature of his work... Why was he not wearing armour and a sword at all times? If I was him, saying the things he said about Freemasonry, I would be sleeping with my armour on and my hand on a weapon. I would surround myself with warrior friends whenever I could to try and remain safe. When you speak out against the Masons you have to be prepared for them to go after you, it gives them a reason to hurt or kill you, just like what they did to they guy who was working on the Grey State movie. Back to Mr. Harun Yahya, strangely, he claims that the Masons were impressed by his work and that they gave him the title of Grandmaster even though he allegedly was never initiated. That is extremely suspicious to me. Freemasons from around the world started praising him, they gave him medals and offered to pay for a lodge that he would be master of. He could be seen on Turkish television sitting with several Masons, exchanging compliments with them and talking about a Fraternal World Order. This is them same man who preaches Islam on television in a room full of women who look like and dress like pornstars. He preaches Islam even though he has no sheikh. I'd rather learn Islam from an old sheikh who looks like Muslim Santa Claus than a middle aged man with a love for cocaine and hookers.

As far as the president of Turkey goes, he is most likely a Mason. He decorated his palace with the same sun hieroglyph that you commonly find on the homes and buildings own by Masons. If the US military is ever patrolling your streets, it might be a good idea to paint that symbol on your door and hope that they think you're a disbeliever and don't kick down your door to execute you. All world leaders are Masons, there is not one speck of land on earth that is not part of Pharaoh's Masonic World Empire. We're told all the time that North Korea and Kim Jung Un are a threat, but that man studied in Switzerland so we are best to assume that he is initiated. They are very proud of Switzerland and Israel. Switzerland is filled with evil doers and greed, it's their HQ. It's a shame to see so many blind Americans bowing down to these depraved, modern day Pharaohs who rob the people of the world of their wealth and hide it all in The Alps. It's no wonder why so many rich Masons have Swiss bank accounts. It's also not a surprise that the Swiss have mastered ODT torture, a torture that damages every cell in your body and kills brain matter first, they even build prisons specially made for it.

Back to the subject of Muslims being Freemasons. I have watched a Master Mason cry while preaching Islam and he was a sincere and good hearted man, to me that is a sign that they cannot be 100% evil, 99% at the most. Many Masons, both Muslim and Christian, are capable of turning away from evil and becoming good people. While I believe in freedom and giving power to the people, I think the Masons have given us a false democracy that is really nothing more than a modern aristocracy. A Muslim who is a Freemason is at the very least, someone who would rather live in a one world government under non Muslim control than a righteous Khalifa under responsible Muslim rule. To me, that is betraying the Ummah. Also remember that the Masons invented atomic weapons and when they go to war, they prefer to kill as many people as possible. When Muslims go to war, we try to minimize casualties on both sides and we don't destroy the land and nature, we don't spread harmful radiation with depleted uranium. Do not be afraid of the Masons, they like it when you fear them. I just hope that the Freemasons surrender peacefully when the people rise up and empower each other, instead of resorting to violence like they always have.
Mar 06, 2017
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		Wow
by: Thane

Just wow. So much paranoia, so little time to refute...

So Kim Jong Un is a Mason because he was educated in Switzerland? I guess Lenin was a Mason, too, because he lived in Switzerland. (Ignore the fact that he banned Freemasonry in 1922.) And the Pope's Swiss Guards must all be Masons, too. Oh, and Tina Turner, because she lived there at one time. And Adolf Hitler visited Switzerland once, so despite having hundreds of thousands of Masons sent to concentration camps, he must have been one, too?

What a crock...

Never heard of Mr Yahya, whoever he is.

As to being prepared to have Masons kill you if you speak out against them, you do realize that *you* are speaking out against them, right? Yet you no doubt be alive for a long while yet - how is that? How is it that the other pathetic fools ranting in their fear and ignorance over the years were not all tracked down and killed? This sort of nonsensical boogieman threat is the trick knee of every murderous conspiracy theory, yet it doesn't stop the claims. Foolish.

With respect to Muslims waging some sort of gentle, eco-war, my thoughts are on the clouds of smoke from burning oil wells lit by Iraqi forces in Kuwait. It is completely true that others have done bad things, too, but please don't preach sanctimonious nonsense.

I have looked at photos of the Turkish presidential palace and seen nothing remotely like a "sun hieroglyph". No doubt you can provide a link showing it. (Whatever it is, for I have been in a lot of Masons' houses and not seen anything like that.)

I could go on and on, but have neither the time nor the energy. Such paranoid fantasies are spread to the foolish and the fearful by those themselves desiring money, power or the appearance of wisdom. Yours is not the first and I doubt it will be the last. They all share the same elements - statements that _______ lust for power, have widespread secret membership by those controlling the world, are willing to kill and torture to protect their secrets, plus references to odd people nobody else has ever heard of, weak logic, bizarre linkages, unsubstantiated arguments, etc.

Go peddle your tripe somewhere else.
Nov 21, 2017
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		True Freemasons do not hate Muslims
by: Michael

I am extremely sad to hear people claiming that Freemasons hate Muslims in this thread. The core value of Freemasonry is charity, which is not meant to be interpreted as simply giving money to good causes but in its earlier and more comprehensive sense which is closer to universal beneficence or love in the modern vernacular. I would say that the Muslim understanding of Ihsan is more or less identical to the masonic conception of charity. Though we often fall short of our ideals, we are instructed to extend that to all people what ever their religion or race, and that includes Islam. As for the relation between Freemasonry and religion, Freemasonry does not seek to replace or oppose any man's religion, but rather extorts him to practice his faith diligently but with toleration and respect for those of other faiths.
Dec 07, 2017
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		Sigh
by: A concerned theist

The amount of misinformation revolving around this thread is extremely annoying and saddening. Since when has any religion taught close-mindedness, shunning and aggravating cultures you know nothing about?

To argue with a freemason about facts concerning freemasonry when one does not himself attend any freemasonry is stupid.

I myself find no problem with freemasonry be you a muslim, jew, christian (although atheists cannot join for obvious reasons). If you want to join or not is up to you and you alone. If you feel that it's wrong - don't join. If you feel that it's right go ahead.
Dec 08, 2017
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		Well said
by: Thane

Michael, Theist - thanks for rational commentary!
Dec 12, 2017
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		Muslim are not permitted to be Freemason
by: Anonymous

As Salaam Alaikum

Muslim joins Freemason is committing haraam.

There secret society is to abolish all religions and God.

They are a CLEAR enemy to God and Islam

Will make you Kafir

Read https://islamqa.info/en/34576

Dec 12, 2017
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		Snicker
by: Jack

Sadly, my friend, you speak from ignorance fueled by blind hatred.

A Muslim who believes such foolishness is ignoring the gifts the Creator has blessed him with.
Dec 13, 2017
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		Yet again...
by: A concerned theist

Why do you speak about matters you do now know about?
Maybe joining Freemasonry is not permitted within Islam, I cannot speak for that. However nowhere have I ever heard that the point of freemasonry is abolishing religion.

They REQUIRE (at least they used to) you to be a theist and to believe in God, they do not want to abolish God...
Dec 13, 2017
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		A Concerned Theist
by: Tharn

Thank you for that,

One of the core requirements for membership in Freemasonry is the belief in a deity. We do not specify which religion a member must follow, only that he believes in God. In fact, atheism is grounds for expulsion from the order.

We teach that every man should honour God as he sees Him to be, to be charitable and just to other people and to work to make himself a better member of society.

Nothing in Freemasonry conflicts with Islam, or any other religion for that matter. It is only those poor individuals who, knowing little, allow themselves to be driven by hatred and fear who think otherwise.
Apr 05, 2018
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starstarstarstarstar 		Freemasons LOVE Muslims
by: Anonymous

Son, The Shriner's (33rd Degree Morons) created the Muslim Brotherhood, which is about to use the Muslims to kill or convert (to Satanic Islam)all Christians and True Jews on earth.

So OF COURSE you can join. Pick up your AK 47 at the door.

You see son, the Freemasons are the children of Satan, and use forbidden knowledge brought by the fallen angels to oppress, suppress and kill all those who believe in the True Father of Israel. Not the Israel of today, which owned by Russia, but the Israel that IS to come.

When you get your AK, BE SURE TO TRY AND KILL A CHRISTIAN, we'll be waiting.
Freemasons are losers.
Apr 05, 2018
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		.
by: Tharn

Ah, our old friend Anon, lending his wisdom...

Not sure what you're on, but you need to change dealers, 'cause your present one is selling you some bad sh*t.
Aug 28, 2018
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		im want change my religion
by: barez

HELLO DEAR my parent a muslim but i dont beilve muslim i can Freemasonry.
I hope this helps answer you question. my email [email protected]
Aug 28, 2018
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starstarstarstarstar 		I want to be a Freemason
by: barez

Hi. I'm 18 years of age and I want to be a Freemason, but my parent a Muslim and I heard rumors that a Muslim can't be a Freemason. I would be grateful if you would tell me whether these rumors are true or false.
[email protected] thank you
Aug 28, 2018
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starstarstarstarstar 		Dear Barez
by: Thane

Thank you for your question. Some Muslim groups, like some Christians, forbid their members from becoming Masons.

Freemasonry, on the other hand, does not bar Muslims from joining. My lodge has several Muslims. We welcome good men of all religions.

One thing however - the usual minimum age to join is 21.

Peace to you.
Aug 28, 2018
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starstarstarstarstar 		Connection between Freemasonry and Islam/Muslims
by: Anonymous

I suggest reading the book Freemasonry Ancient Egypt and the Islamic Destiny by Mustafa EL-Amin
Aug 28, 2018
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		Oh, yes
by: Thane

Dr El-Amin is rather famous for his opposition to Freemasonry. I am always amused by those who, as in this case, try to link modern Freemasonry with Ancient Egypt.

That said, I too would encourage those interested to read the book in question. Please read it carefully, but don't stop there. Continue your research, look elsewhere, consult multiple sources - and then make up your own mind as opposed to having somebody else do it for you.

This is, if it matters, one of the key differences between Freemasonry and its critics. We encourage free thought, open minds. See how much criticism of the Craft hinges on long-discredited sources and claims, feeble logic and closed minded thinking.

Through Freemasonry, I have met and become friends with many Muslims. I have been impressed with them and their faith.

Please, do your own research and then decide for yourself. Peace to you.
Oct 03, 2018
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		So...
by: Pizza Delivery Guy

Salam Alykum

For the past few hours, I've read almost all the comments in this thread, just skipped a few in the dates of 2015 because I accidentally scrolled down. :)

Anyways, I'm Muslim and trying to read and learn both sides to reach an informed decision the same way I did when I studied Islam and Christianity since my parents are one Muslim and other Christian.

Now, it's really sad to see that a lot of the comments are being posted with no proof. I like proof, I want proof. Don't tell me the Freemasons are evil and want to kill everyone and what not, my Grandfather is a Mason and never did he try to kill me. Give me proof, say the Freemasons are a bunch of people who want to worship the evil Pizza devil and spread anchovies on all the pizza of the world... WITH PROOF. If you have no proof, then stay silent.
Since the Masons are the ones being accused, they don't have to provide proof, only the accusers.

I'm not a Mason, I was raised being told that they're evil, I will not pass judgment until I use my brains and logic that Allah gifted me. With that being said, some of you have claimed that joining the Freemasons is shirk and one becomes Kafir, I read the fatwa page that some have cited, but why? Where's the proof? Not everything the Sheiks says I take for granted because a lot of our modern day Fatwas are influenced by politics, like the fatwas from KSA and Al Azhar against some groups in Palestine where in fact they had contradictory Fatwas before or after for example.

Allah Subhanu has told us to use our minds, so I use it with the Quran, and until now, I see no proof or contradictions.

I know the formula next, "don't join them" "Haram" "you become Kafir" and etc... (IF) I say, IF I did want to become a Mason, it is no one's business but my own, Allah will be my witness and judge my intentions, not you. You as a Muslim should give me a valid and with proof opinion and advice, that's it.

Do not tell me they worship evil and whatnot because for over four years here in this thread I have not seen any proof from that claim. Give me proof, then I will listen. As far as I'm concerned, it's just a faternity club that works on bettering the person and community, sure Islam is number one when it comes to that which I'm not denying, but I see no harm in having also a group of people who join together to work on something good. Or is it because they're non muslims? if so, that's an entirely different topic, very... very long topic.

The only thing I want form the Masons here is to prove that The Protocols of the Elders of Zion in regards to the Freemasons to be a hoax as some has said.

Salam Alykum
Oct 05, 2018
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starstarstarstarstar 		Welcome!
by: Thane

Welcome. I will admit to being deeply impressed. I wish more people – of all races, all faiths – could show this level of intellectual maturity.

But about ’The Protocols’. First off, please don’t take anything I say as fact. Please do your own research, check the facts for yourself and only then make up your mind.

There are a number of reasons. Many of them are subtle. For instance, one of the early reprints of the book was as an annex in a book by a Russian mystic named Sergei Nilus. Nilus claimed that the meetings referred to in ‘The Protocols’ took place in 1902, yet he also claimed to have received the original transcript in 1901.

‘The Protocols’ fail to mention anything about the reestablishment of a Jewish nation, Israel. Odd, wouldn’t you think?

There are others.

The major argument however against ‘The Protocols’ being authentic is that large portions of the book were clearly plagiarized, stolen, from another book.

In 1864, the French writer Maurice Joly published a pamphlet ‘Dialogues in Hell Between Machiavelli and Montesquieu’. This booklet was a political satire aimed at then-Emperor of France Napoleon III. Joly didn’t even mention the Jews. (He wasn’t Jewish, either, if that matters.)

The ‘Dialogues’ were taken up by a convicted German forger named Hermann Goedsche. Twisting Joly’s book, Goedsche turned that into a completely fictional book, ‘Biarritz’ which was published in 1868. In the chapter ‘The Jewish Cemetery in Prague and the Council of Representatives of the Twelve Tribes of Israel; we see for the first time a secret Jewish conspiracy, a midnight council of rabbis discussing their plan to take over the world.

‘Biarritz’ found fertile ground in strongly antisemitic Russia of the time, where the Okhrana, the far-right Russian secret police (which had its own political agenda), saw the book as a way to fight liberal political reforms which they felt were dangerous. A man working for the Okhrana c. 1890, Matvei (or Mathieu) Golovinski, rewrote the books of Joly and Goedsche for the Okhrana, calling it ‘Protocols of the Learned Elders of Zion’.

The book was published in Russia but met with little success until after the failed liberal revolution of 1905, when it was flogged by the far-right in Russia as a way to counter liberal tendencies which were supposed to be driven by Jews – and of course the Bolsheviks, who ‘everybody knew’ were all Jews anyway.

‘The Protocols’ – and again I urge you to check for yourself – contain large chunks of Joly’s original satire, rewritten to accuse the Jews of a world-wide conspiracy.

How did Freemasonry come in? Well, Freemasonry has always encouraged its members to think for themselves, to accept the goodness of all people. We accept Jews in our lodges. We do not open our doors to everyone. Some of our allegorical lessons are based on the construction of King Solomon’s temple in Jerusalem. Such things, in some minds, provide a perfect link between Freemasonry and Judaism.

But here’s the thing to ask yourself, sir, the ‘acid test’ for this book. If ‘The Protocols’ are a real exposé of a Jewish master plan to control the world, why does it copy almost word for word a French anti-monarchical satire of 40 years earlier? There can be only one answer – ‘The Protocols’ were a fake and remain so today, over a century later.

This plagiarism was first openly shown by the ‘Times’ of London in August 1921 in a detailed examination of ‘The Protocols’. ‘The Times’ concluded that ‘The Protocols’ were a hoax.

The book was again exhaustively dissected by several German courts over the period 1934-37. Evidence given there showed that not less than 176 sections of ‘The Protocols’ has been copied from Joly’s ‘Dialogues’. The court firmly deemed ‘The Protocols’ to be fraudulent. (Bear in mind that this verdict was issued at the time of the virulently antisemitic Nazi regime in Germany!)

Other courts, other studies, have all pronounced it to be a fraud. Yet, forgery though it is, ‘The Protocols’ reinforces the beliefs of anybody who hates Jews and for that reason alone the book survives.

Again, please check all this out for yourself.

It is my personal opinion that our Creator gave us minds so that we may think. The refusal to use that gift is the ultimate rebellion against the Almighty to gave it to us.

Peace to you, sir.
Oct 05, 2018
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		re Thane
by: Pizza Delivery Guy

Thank you for the information. I did read about it being plagiarised but not in details, and you gave me a whole bunch of that.

Again, Thank you for your time.

Salam Alykum
Nov 26, 2018
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		Everything ain't for everybody
by: Anonymous

As Salaam Alaikum...Li Brother, now when I was young I to had a strong desire to join the loyal Brotherhood of Prince Hall...I seen friends and family...become members and seen 1st hand how there lives changed...for what seem to be the better.... they got good jobs... nice cars... and phat homes...in a matter of no time
And believe me I wanted that too...
But as time went on I was shown indirectly signs that enable me to ser that Prince Hall was no place for a practicing Sunni Muslim... now I'm not the best example of my faith.. and I'm not bragging... but I came to understand that everything ain't for everybody... to me my way and to them theirs
May 13, 2019
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starstarstarstarstar 		Freemasonry
by: [email protected]

I want to b a Freemason but have no insight or anyone close enough to enlighten me 😔...
May 13, 2019
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starstarstarstarstar 		More info, please
by: Tharn

It would help if we knew where you are located.
Sep 23, 2019
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starstarstarstarstar 		One world !
by: Anonymous

Yaba Dana do The only thing we all need is love Love your family your fellow people the earth and all its inhabitants - treat everyone regardless of their demeanor with kindness and compassion. Y label yourself with a symbol a special handshake, we all belong to Mother Earth - no one is better - no one superior/- regardless color creed religion etc. peace n love to you all!
Oct 08, 2019
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starstarstarstarstar 		Ethernal discussion with Muslims
by: Anonymous

i do not what the problem is. Let the muslims decide. If a person is not an open minded one it is not convenient he brings in contact with our order.
Muslim's problem is that they have had an intensive struggle with the crypto gnostics in their organisations.
Some of them are reluctant to share spaces with atheists, agnostics and gnostics and oriental religions as buddhism
May 22, 2021
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starstarstarstarstar 		Interested in joining
by: Ashraf Shawwa

The question should not be can be you be a muslim and be a freemason. The question should be can you be a freemason and be a Muslim. Unless you are Allah ﷻ and you can positively tell someone you are going to hell or heaven. Please stay silent. A man of knowledge will always be a man of power closer to Allah ﷻ. Because Allah ﷻ is AlAleem ﷻ. Do not let others whisper to you what to do. Remember the devils will always remain in the shadows. That is why my name is public. Do as you please, and remember Allah ﷻ is AlHakem ﷻ. Not an anonymous source online. I am not a freemason, but insha'Allah I pray to AlMujeeb ﷻ to allow me to be one. And when AlHaqq ﷻ decides the truth, it is not someone else's duty to tell you otherwise
May 22, 2021
Rating
starstarstarstarstar 		Peace to you
by: Thane

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